A new Batman.

[ruggedo]

There is a lot of talk about the Cowl stories here, and there is some coversation about some of the directions books are taking leading out of this series,but I wondered if readers and fans are really happy about a Batman who isnt Bruce Wayne?
I think nearly every day at the shop we have a conversation/arguement about this. The opinions usually divide up with the long time readers(from the sixties and seventies) all thinking you cant have Batman without Bruce, and newer readers(the last twenty years) kind of thinking its a good idea. This is not a hundred percent,but for the most part it breaks up that way.
So what do people think here?

[Gritty]

There is a lot of talk about the Cowl stories here, and there is some coversation about some of the directions books are taking leading out of this series,but I wondered if readers and fans are really happy about a Batman who isnt Bruce Wayne?
I think nearly every day at the shop we have a conversation/arguement about this. The opinions usually divide up with the long time readers(from the sixties and seventies) all thinking you cant have Batman without Bruce, and newer readers(the last twenty years) kind of thinking its a good idea. This is not a hundred percent,but for the most part it breaks up that way.
So what do people think here?

If you tell good stories it doesn't matter who's wearing the cowl.

[TheMojoPin]

If you tell good stories it doesn't matter who's wearing the cowl.

Pretty much. Dick Grayson is a great charcter and any writer worth their salt could easily write a ton of great stories with him as Batman. Hell, the same thing would be true if Tim Drake takes over down the line.

Honestly, I think Bruce Wayne is one of the most underdeveloped "civilian" identities in comics. He's ultimately been a rather bland and predictable character when he's not "being" Batman. Dick and Tim have the benefit of being, in my opinion, much better characters when they're not superheroing.

[sr71blackbird]

Any Batman will need huge finances to put together his gear and needs some sort of financing. How would someone realistically be a Batman without a big bankroll?

[TheMojoPin]

Any Batman will need huge finances to put together his gear and needs some sort of financing. How would someone realistically be a Batman without a big bankroll?

Dick Grayson and Tim Drake are, I think the legal heirs of Bruce Wayne. If he died, the money would go to one or both of them. Or it could be left to Alfred. Or Wayne could still be around, but just not as Batman. It's pretty easy to work wih.

[kdubya]

Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w255/kdubya8/pictures%20for%20the%20message%20board/azrael-b.jpg

[TheMojoPin]

Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w255/kdubya8/pictures%20for%20the%20message%20board/azrael-b.jpg

That was a storyline done with the specific idea that Bruce Wayne would eventually be back as Batman (though some planned it as a setup for Dick Grayson to take over, which hapened, but that too was only done temporarily). "Azbats" wasn't a mistake at all.

[EliSnow]

That was a storyline done with the specific idea that Bruce Wayne would eventually be back as Batman (though some planned it as a setup for Dick Grayson to take over, which hapened, but that too was only done temporarily). "Azbats" wasn't a mistake at all.

Exactly. They did the whole storyline to illustrate why Batman is not the Punisher, and shouldn't be like the Punisher.

[Aqualad]

I would love to see Dick Grayson or Tim Drake as Batman for an extended period of time. It would make the book feel fresh, as the sidekicks adjust to their new roles, and encounter the rogues as Batman for the first time.

[TheMojoPin]

Exactly. They did the whole storyline to illustrate why Batman is not the Punisher, and shouldn't be like the Punisher.

Plus I actually really liked most of the story around Azrael. I thought the "Knightfall" build-up was really well done. They did a great job of stretching that out over months and building Bane up into being a genuine A-class villain as well as really beating Bats into the ground physically and mentally. I liked all the stuff while Azrael was Batman of the people around him reacting to the change as well as Bruce's efforts to rebuild himself. Then you had him coming back and that all bleeding ino Grayson taking over for a really cool run. Of all the "big event" storylines of the 1990's that were done with dollars on the brain, I thought that one was actually pretty decent and way better than the rest.

[kdubya]

My point is that from time to time there is a new spin about how some major character will be killed off, and it kind of happens but in the long run it doesn't really matter. In my opinion the Batman character is best served through stand alone stories and not overly complex story lines.

What was the outcome of Knightfall? Nothing really, the character didn't have any real new development because it is an already developed character.

Take Batman and put him in interesting situations, have him face new challenges, but enough with trying to shake the charter to the core. Killing him would never be permanent anyway.

It's like they say, no one stays dead except for Bucky. And even that isn't true anymore.

If you want to see what it likes to have Batman dead, do and Elseworlds story.
Part of the appeal of the DC big dogs is they are pretty much timeless, I wish writers would stop trying to change that.

[TheMojoPin]

I would love to see Dick Grayson or Tim Drake as Batman for an extended period of time. It would make the book feel fresh, as the sidekicks adjust to their new roles, and encounter the rogues as Batman for the first time.

DC has a really good track record of creating "replacements" that are really good characters in their own right, even if the company ends up wimping out and bringing back the originals. Kyle Rayner, Wally West, Green Arrow II...stick with them, DC!

[TheMojoPin]

My point is that from time to time there is a new spin about how some major character will be killed off, and it kind of happens but in the long run it doesn't really matter. In my opinion the Batman character is best served through stand alone stories and not overly complex story lines.

What was the outcome of Knightfall? Nothing really, the character didn't have any real new development because it is an already developed character.

Take Batman and put him in interesting situations, have him face new challenges, but enough with trying to shake the charter to the core. Killing him would never be permanent anyway.

It's like they say, no one stays dead except for Bucky. And even that isn't true anymore.

If you want to see what it likes to have Batman dead, do and Elseworlds story.
Part of the appeal of the DC big dogs is they are pretty much timeless, I wish writers would stop trying to change that.

And look how good the Bucky storyline is. It's easily the best Cap storyline in years and one of the best of all time.

I actually agree with you in a roundabout way...none of this "matters," so why limit things by just doing repeats of the same stories? The beauty of comics is you can always flip things back or try something new.

[EliSnow]

I would love to see Dick Grayson or Tim Drake as Batman for an extended period of time. It would make the book feel fresh, as the sidekicks adjust to their new roles, and encounter the rogues as Batman for the first time.

Well, Dick has faced these rogues as Batman before. In a story called Prodigal (I think), Bruce retired for awhile following the Azrael storyline and Dick took over the role temporarily.

[kdubya]

DC has a really good track record of creating "replacements" that are really good characters in their own right, even if the company ends up wimping out and bringing back the originals. Kyle Rayner, Wally West, Green Arrow II...stick with them, DC!



I agree, and a good mix of moving up existing charcters and introducing new ones.

[kdubya]

And look how good the Bucky storyline is. It's easily the best Cap storyline in years and one of the best of all time.

I actually agree with you in a roundabout way...none of this "matters," so why limit things by just doing repeats of the same stories? The beauty of comics is you can always flip things back or try something new.


I can't argue with that.

I just get fed up with the ammount of earth shaking that takes place. Maybe I have been around too long to allow myself to get excited about the next big event.

[TheMojoPin]

Yeah, I don't get "excited" per se. I typically only read an event if I like the writers involved. If It's a writer I like, I want to see how they're going to pull it off and tell a good story. Even if it's supposed to be a big crossover epic, the best writers will still put together a self-contained story.

[Aqualad]

Well, Dick has faced these rogues as Batman before. In a story called Prodigal (I think), Bruce retired for awhile following the Azrael storyline and Dick took over the role temporarily.

Yeah but that was a total of like two months. I was buying Robin at the time and Dick was Batman literally for three issues before Bruce Wayne came back.

I'd like to see the same thing stretched out over a year or so.

[EliSnow]

Yeah but that was a total of like two months. I was buying Robin at the time and Dick was Batman literally for three issues before Bruce Wayne came back.

I'd like to see the same thing stretched out over a year or so.

I thought it was a little longer than 3 issues, even close to a year. I could be wrong though.

[kdubya]

I thought it was a little longer than 3 issues, even close to a year. I could be wrong though.


I think it ran in several different titles over a few months, so even thoguh it was a short time there was a good bit of material.

I liked the covers. It started out with black cover with an image of Batman in relief. As the story went along the image got lighter and lighter to reveal batman in a grey and black uniform.

[ruggedo]

Well, Dick has faced these rogues as Batman before. In a story called Prodigal (I think), Bruce retired for awhile following the Azrael storyline and Dick took over the role temporarily.

Prodigal Son is out in a trade paperback and its one of my favorite modern Batman stories. I agree its interesting to see how other members of the Batman family handle wearing the cowl. My problem comes with how can they actually be Batman? I see Batman as a completely psychological creation. One man in a situation that just cant be replicated, and his individual reaction to it. He wasnt created by chemicals or a construct of magic. Its just him,in his own head with his own moratlity and rules. Someone can be close, Dick Grayson lost his parents too before he became Robin,but each person reacts differently.
That's my arguement for Bruce Wayne,but I love the way others see this too. Like I said,because of what is going on now, not a day goes by where we dont have this conversation at the store, and if it wasnt interesting and fun it wouldnt go on as long as it does.

[booster11373]

I think an awesome version would be Dick as Batman and Tim still as Robin and run with it for a while but that doesnt seem to be whats going to happen

[cougarjake13]

i think we have to have new people take over the roles


i know its comics and all but we cant seriously have bruce wayne as batman in 2050

i mean there's only so many storylines they can come up with that are new


its kinda one of my pet peeves, like bart still being 8 yrs old or whatever he is , event though the show is 20 yrs old



i mean they invent new villians all the time but the same guy is batman, spiderman, etc.



i'd actually like it for some major character who's currently a superhero, retire or die for good and the new guy is the superhero for a long time, not a few issues or a mini run

[kdubya]

I like Tim and Dick, but as Batman I am not sure they have what it takes.

Wasn't one of the reasons Robin was introduced, or at least came back after Jason Todd was killed, was to have a balance to Bruces darkness. How can a charectoer that has served as the yin to Bruce's yang now be the yang. Bruce is at his core a tourtured soul. His rage is part of what pushes Batman. His pain and rage allows him to commit to the most extreme sittuations. Dick and Tim have both suffered loss but didn't have the same reaction as Bruce. They are more optomistic about the world.

I think Tim and Dick have the skills, but they lack the darkside.

[EliSnow]

I like Tim and Dick, but as Batman I am not sure they have what it takes.

Wasn't one of the reasons Robin was introduced, or at least came back after Jason Todd was killed, was to have a balance to Bruces darkness. How can a charectoer that has served as the yin to Bruce's yang now be the yang. Bruce is at his core a tourtured soul. His rage is part of what pushes Batman. His pain and rage allows him to commit to the most extreme sittuations. Dick and Tim have both suffered loss but didn't have the same reaction as Bruce. They are more optomistic about the world.

I think Tim and Dick have the skills, but they lack the darkside.

Tim's dark side has increased over the years. He lost his father to a supervillain, as well as his best friends, and now his adopted father. There was even a storyline in Teen Titans where a future Tim Drake came back as Batman and he was arguably even more dark than Batman (he used guns, etc).

[EliSnow]

The other thing to note is that Grant Morrison has already stated that the next Batman will not be as dark as Bruce:

It's much more…contentious. This is a very different Batman and Robin team from any that we've seen before. It's almost a reverse of the traditional dynamic, with a more light-hearted and spontaneous Batman and a scowling, badass Robin. Expect fireworks and violence.

http://comicsmedia.ign.com/comics/image/article/961/961044/batman-robin-20090310030958573_640w.jpg

[TheMojoPin]

Sounds like Grayson and Batman's jerkstore son.

[EliSnow]

Sounds like Grayson and Batman's jerkstore son.

I agree.

[booster11373]

But what becomes of Tim? Red Robin? NiteWing? retire?

[kdubya]

Tim's dark side has increased over the years. He lost his father to a supervillain, as well as his best friends, and now his adopted father. There was even a storyline in Teen Titans where a future Tim Drake came back as Batman and he was arguably even more dark than Batman (he used guns, etc).



I read Teen Titans as well, but I still say he lacks the darkness for a prolonged stay as Batman, his pain doesn't run as deep. I think he has even made stayments about how he will never be as dark as Bruce.

You can provide all kinds of examples from other books that shows Tim or Dick as being dark but I still say Bruce and Batman are the same person, his history is what made charecter. Batman more than most heroes is based on their history and development more than the mantle they wear. Batman and Bruce are really the same. You can have different guys with The Flash's tallents and it can work. You can give different people a power ring and have a Green Lanter. But Batman is the set of circustances that created him more than the belt or his skills.

[kdubya]

But what becomes of Tim? Red Robin? NiteWing? retire?


Tim walking away from it all at some point makes the most sense for the charecter. He is smarter than any other Robin, and maybe smarter than Bruce. I think the more ballsy way to go is for him to say violance is not the way and leave. They tried it once and Tim came back, but I think that is the story to tell. Robin leaving the life for good, and how it effects Batman. Dick left to be on his own, Jason was killed, Stephanie didn't listen and was kicked out, but none of them just up and left. Tim saying to Bruce. "I think you are wrong" and just leaving would make a great story.

[EliSnow]

I read Teen Titans as well, but I still say he lacks the darkness for a prolonged stay as Batman, his pain doesn't run as deep. I think he has even made stayments about how he will never be as dark as Bruce.

You can provide all kinds of examples from other books that shows Tim or Dick as being dark but I still say Bruce and Batman are the same person, his history him. Batman more than most heroes is based on their history and development more than the mantle they wear. Batman and Bruce are really the same. You can have different guys with The Flash's tallents and it can work. You can give different people a power ring and have a Green Lanter. But Batman is the set of circustances that created him more than the belt or his skills.

The only reason we can say that is because Bruce really has been the only Batman for such a long time period. And for you Batman is the man who wears the Batman mantle now.

What DC may be doing is saying that Batman is a mantle that can be passed, just as the Captain America mantle was passed.

[EliSnow]

Tim walking away from it all at some point makes the most sense for the charecter. He is smarter than any other Robin, and maybe smarter than Bruce. I think the more ballsy way to go is for him to say violance is not the way and leave. They tried it once and Tim came back, but I think that is the story to tell. Robin leaving the life for good, and how it effects Batman. Dick left to be on his own, Jason was killed, Stephanie didn't listen and was kicked out, but none of them just up and left. Tim saying to Bruce. "I think you are wrong" and just leaving would make a great story.

Except that story can't happen in the near future because Bruce is gone.

So what does Tim do, when he's not Robin and he's not Batman?

BTW, there will be a Red Robin series starting this summer.

[kdubya]

Except that story can't happen in the near future because Bruce is gone.

So what does Tim do, when he's not Robin and he's not Batman?

BTW, there will be a Red Robin series starting this summer.

I am not saying this is likely, I just feel that would be the better story. Killing him is easy. I mean what easier way to change a character than to kill the current incarnation.

I think a disagreement between Tim and Bruce about the fundamental style of Batman would be a great story. Taking Batman apart piece by piece through Tim’s criticism would be compelling. Bruce trying to be Batman but thinking back on what Tim said, and Tim’s condemnation of his tactics would be Watchman level stuff. Tim looking him in the eye and saying “Bruce, after all these years the criminals keep coming back, have you really made it any better?”

Bruce is so sure he is correct; it would take his respect for Tim as a man to force him to question what he is doing.

So not saying it will happen, but it would be a great read. Why take the easy road of killing him, find a new path and Watchmen this bitch.

[EliSnow]

I am not saying this is likely, I just feel that would be the better story. Killing him is easy. I mean what easier way to change a character than to kill the current incarnation.

I think a disagreement between Tim and Bruce about the fundamental style of Batman would be a great story. Taking Batman apart piece by piece through Tim’s criticism would be compelling. Bruce trying to be Batman but thinking back on what Tim said, and Tim’s condemnation of his tactics would be Watchman level stuff. Tim looking him in the eye and saying “Bruce, after all these years the criminals keep coming back, have you really made it any better?”

Bruce is so sure he is correct; it would take his respect for Tim as a man to force him to question what he is doing.

So not saying it will happen, but it would be a great read. Why take the easy road of killing him, find a new path and Watchmen this bitch.

Killing who? I don't think I've seen anything about killing Tim.

[booster11373]

Batman doesnt need to be dark in order to be good

[kdubya]

Killing who? I don't think I've seen anything about killing Tim.


Killing Batman.

My argument is killing Batman is the easy way to shake up the franchise. I am just offering an alternative I would like to see.

[EliSnow]

Killing Batman.

He's already gone.

[EliSnow]

Killing Batman.

My argument is killing Batman is the easy way to shake up the franchise. I am just offering an alternative I would like to see.

But they've already done it. Bruce is gone, and someone else needs to wear the cowl.

[kdubya]

Batman doesnt need to be dark in order to be good


What is a good non-dark Batman tale?

The only one I can think of off the top of my head is the "Snow" story in Legends of TDK from a year or so ago.

[EliSnow]

I think a disagreement between Tim and Bruce about the fundamental style of Batman would be a great story. Taking Batman apart piece by piece through Tim’s criticism would be compelling. Bruce trying to be Batman but thinking back on what Tim said, and Tim’s condemnation of his tactics would be Watchman level stuff. Tim looking him in the eye and saying “Bruce, after all these years the criminals keep coming back, have you really made it any better?”

Bruce is so sure he is correct; it would take his respect for Tim as a man to force him to question what he is doing.



Just circling back to this. I've seen at least three or four different times where Bruce or someone else has asked him this very question and cause Bruce to have doubt. Usually, it's Robin or Alfred that helps talk Bruce through it that he has done good because he has saved lives.

And doing a Watchmen really isn't pratical given what realities of the business. They are producing ongoing Batman stories and like to keep the popular villains that Batman has to fight over and over again. So killing the Joker or stopping him permanently in some other fashion really isn't an available approach.

[EliSnow]

What is a good non-dark Batman tale?

The only one I can think of off the top of my head is the "Snow" story in Legends of TDK from a year or so ago.

A number of the 1970's Dennis O'Neil/Neal Adams Batman stories, such as the Ra's Al Ghul stories, are really good and I don't see them as being "dark" Batman stories.

Plus, there are a lot of good "detective" Batman stories that are really good because they explore Bats' detective side and not his dark side.

[TheMojoPin]

You could argue that the Dark Knight Returns is the Wachmen-ing of Batman. Not nearly as complex or thought out, but somewhat similar.

[kdubya]

Doing a Watchmen in the sense of stepping outside the norms and blazing a new path.

I still say a true showdown between Tim and Bruce, really getting to the core of who they each are and what they think of the others choice would be great. A line in the sand type of moment. Sure others have questioned Bruce, but Tim laying out a detailed and thought out assessment of why he is wrong would be compelling and change the face of the character. Bruce being confronted by what he believes to be an intellectual equal. Tim figured out his identity, I say the logical progression is for him to figure out what truly makes him tick. If that lead to him saying Bruce is flawed would have me slapping down $2.99 to read about it.

In my opinion Tim Drake is one of the best characters in comics. He is smart and cunning beyond anyone, maybe even Bruce Wayne. He has some much potential. I think having him do an about face and find a new path would truly be good story telling.

[Aqualad]

Batman doesnt need to be dark in order to be good

Seriously, did I wake up in 1989 or what? I thought the 'grimngritty' was passe these days.

[kdubya]

Seriously, did I wake up in 1989 or what? I thought the 'grimngritty' was passe these days.

Dark and 'grimandgritty' are different things.

Batman is dark in the sense that he was created from pain and loss. His entire persona is based on people fearing him.

[DarkHippie]

the fact is that they would have to do this eventually. I can't remember DC doing any character reboots like Marvel does, so bruce will at some point be too old. He's not like superman or wonder woman where you can write it off as not having to age or aging slowly.

Dick will be a good Batman. Because he's not dark like Bruce, he will bring a new dimension to the story telling

[Aqualad]

Dark and 'grimandgritty' are different things.

Batman is dark in the sense that he was created from pain and loss. His entire persona is based on people fearing him.

Yeah but. It's Batman. Adam West. Joel Schumaker. The Brave and the Bold. Superfriends.

We're not exactly talking Hamlet here. There are a lot of fun Batman stories...pain and tragedy doesn't have to be the character's sole motivating factor. Look at Morrison's JLA- the Batman in that comic wasn't a morose emo douche. He took his job seriously, but he had a sense of humor. One of the biggest problems of 1990's Batman comics were that they were all mope all the time.

[kdubya]

Yeah but. It's Batman. Adam West. Joel Schumaker. The Brave and the Bold. Superfriends.

We're not exactly talking Hamlet here. There are a lot of fun Batman stories...pain and tragedy doesn't have to be the character's sole motivating factor. Look at Morrison's JLA- the Batman in that comic wasn't a morose emo douche. He took his job seriously, but he had a sense of humor. One of the biggest problems of 1990's Batman comics were that they were all mope all the time.

I see what you are saying, but I still contend that at his core there is darkness. Darkness doesn't have to be Emo or a downer.

Batman can be fun, but in those moments where he is truly tested and pushed to the limit he falls back on his unwavering determination that comes from what happened to him as a kid. he knows he has to dedicate himself 100%.

In Morrison's run on JLA he even refers to Batman as the most dangerous man on earth, not because he is the strongest but because he is willing to do what needs to be done and is relentless in his pursuit oh what he feels is right. Once again a product of his past.

[ruggedo]

Bruce isnt gone,just in case anyone hasnt caught that. In fact at the recent comic con in NYC,DiDeo said that eventually you will see Bruce in the cowl again,but until then they would have some fun with it. The interview was on G4. Now that is a complete turn around from what he had been saying before that,but that is the latest word. Also what hasnt been said,the word around the DC offices has been that they have made some really big mistakes with the Batman family titles and they would be looking to correct them in the next twelve months. This information is second hand tho,but the source has been reliable before.

[Aqualad]

Bruce isnt gone,just in case anyone hasnt caught that. In fact at the recent comic con in NYC,DiDeo said that eventually you will see Bruce in the cowl again,but until then they would have some fun with it. The interview was on G4. Now that is a complete turn around from what he had been saying before that,but that is the latest word. Also what hasnt been said,the word around the DC offices has been that they have made some really big mistakes with the Batman family titles and they would be looking to correct them in the next twelve months. This information is second hand tho,but the source has been reliable before.

Didn't anybody read Final Crisis? Bruce Wayne is alive and well and living as a caveman.

[EliSnow]

Didn't anybody read Final Crisis? Bruce Wayne is alive and well and living as a caveman.



Hence, my use of the word "gone" as opposed to "dead.". And not only is he in a cave, it's a cave likely on a parallel earth.

[kdubya]

Bruce isnt gone,just in case anyone hasnt caught that. In fact at the recent comic con in NYC,DiDeo said that eventually you will see Bruce in the cowl again,but until then they would have some fun with it. The interview was on G4. Now that is a complete turn around from what he had been saying before that,but that is the latest word. Also what hasnt been said,the word around the DC offices has been that they have made some really big mistakes with the Batman family titles and they would be looking to correct them in the next twelve months. This information is second hand tho,but the source has been reliable before.


The more things change the more they stay the same.

I remember them saying something similar around the time War Games came out, so they made Batman a loner again, and that lasted less than a year.

I am so over huge crossovers and direction changing events.

Anymore I prefer stand alone stories out of the regular series. Give me "Snow" over "RIP" any day.

[ruggedo]

The more things change the more they stay the same.

I remember them saying something similar around the time War Games came out, so they made Batman a loner again, and that lasted less than a year.

I am so over huge crossovers and direction changing events.

Anymore I prefer stand alone stories out of the regular series. Give me "Snow" over "RIP" any day.

I used to love Batman Adventures for just that reason. Each book was a complete story. It didnt hurt that the original animation guys Timm and Dini did that book and I loved that whole concept of that version of Batman too. I think the story Mad Love for that series won the Eisner Award too.

[EliSnow]

I used to love Batman Adventures for just that reason. Each book was a complete story. It didnt hurt that the original animation guys Timm and Dini did that book and I loved that whole concept of that version of Batman too. I think the story Mad Love for that series won the Eisner Award too.

Mad Love was from that series.

[JustJon]

I used to love Batman Adventures for just that reason. Each book was a complete story. It didnt hurt that the original animation guys Timm and Dini did that book and I loved that whole concept of that version of Batman too. I think the story Mad Love for that series won the Eisner Award too.

Timm and Dini didn't do the comic. The original artist was Mike Parobeck until he died of diabetic complications.

[ruggedo]

Timm and Dini didn't do the comic. The original artist was Mike Parobeck until he died of diabetic complications.

Timm and Dini did write the books,but I did leave out the artist, Parobeck, and his story telling technique as well as simpler but great images really did a lot to make this book.

[Aqualad]

Timm and Dini didn't do the comic. The original artist was Mike Parobeck until he died of diabetic complications.

Timm and Dini did special issues like annuals and the Mad Love one-shot. The Dini/ Timm stuff was collected in a TPB called Dangerous Dames and Demons.

Mike Parobeck was good on the book, but in my opinion Ty Templeton owned that series- he both wrote and pencilled at different times.

[ruggedo]

Timm and Dini did special issues like annuals and the Mad Love one-shot. The Dini/ Timm stuff was collected in a TPB called Dangerous Dames and Demons.

Mike Parobeck was good on the book, but in my opinion Ty Templeton owned that series- he both wrote and pencilled at different times.

Wow I forgot all about Templeton and when I was reading these regularly I used to tell anyone who would listen about him! I really brought this series up because of the fact it always had one issue stories,but I did love the book.

[JustJon]

Timm and Dini did write the books,but I did leave out the artist, Parobeck, and his story telling technique as well as simpler but great images really did a lot to make this book.

Timm and Dini did special issues like annuals and the Mad Love one-shot. The Dini/ Timm stuff was collected in a TPB called Dangerous Dames and Demons.

Mike Parobeck was good on the book, but in my opinion Ty Templeton owned that series- he both wrote and pencilled at different times.

Yeah, I should have said they did "special issues," but did not write the overall series.

[ruggedo]

Wow I forgot all about Templeton and when I was reading these regularly I used to tell anyone who would listen about him! I really brought this series up because of the fact it always had one issue stories,but I did love the book.

Quoting myself here because of the last name we all have left out on this series and easily as important as anyone else is Kelly Puckett, the writer of the original BA series. And,again, I really brought this up because month to month the stories were all self contained,for the most part, and just really well written, designed and drawn.