Maybe he should be called "A-Roid" (A ghee ghee ghee)

[Judge Smails]

Sources tell SI Alex Rodriguez tested positive for steroids in 2003 (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/02/07/alex-rodriguez-steroids/index.html)


In 2003, when he won the American League home run title and the AL Most Valuable Player award as a shortstop for the Texas Rangers (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/mlb/teams/rangers), Alex Rodriguez (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/mlb/players/5275) tested positive for two anabolic steroids, four sources have independently told Sports Illustrated.


I know some people were counting on Arod to break Bonds' homerun record to return some legitimacy to it. I wonder how this affects it?

[hammersavage]

I know everyone was on roids but this one is still surprising.

[SP1!]

Doesn't surprise me, quite a lot of guys used them to get over injuries, I would expect ken caminitis original figure of 70%-80% is most likely right for steroid use.

I still don't understand how cortisone shots are legal in the NFL, that is just a steroid to make the pain go away for a few days, its also why a lot of NFL players have really bad arthritis later since you should only use it once every few months and these guys use it almost weekly.

[A.J.]

Guess Canseco was right after all.

[TheMojoPin]

Guess Canseco was right after all.

Whoulda thunk?

http://www.pursuingholiness.com/wp-content/uploads/dignity.jpg

So wha does this say about ARod's numbers? They didn't drop off in the last 4 years, seems like this was probably a case of someone trying to stay off the DL. And weren't the results of the 2003 tests supposed to be kept secret?

[razorboy]

As if it were possible, Douchey Von Douchenberg just got douchier. Enjoy the ridicule, asshat.

[jauble]

Whoulda thunk?

http://www.pursuingholiness.com/wp-content/uploads/dignity.jpg

So wha does this say about ARod's numbers? They didn't drop off in the last 4 years, seems like this was probably a case of someone trying to stay off the DL. And weren't the results of the 2003 tests supposed to be kept secret?

Yes this was a leak that went against the agreement between the player's union and the league. He should be able to bring up a law suit if the sources are revealed.

[barjockey]

This couldnt make me happier. I love baseball but lets face it they all cheat. Who's next Pujols?

[razorboy]

At least we know that the future greatest third baseman of all time, Evan Longoria, is clean.

[RingWraith]

At least we know that the future greatest third baseman of all time, Evan Longoria, is clean.

For now.:dry:

[ChrisTheCop]

Siriusly? We're shocked? I really thought it was a given that he somehow escaped.

And just for equal time, I will also not be shocked (though somewhat more sad) if Youkilis' name comes up in all this.

But I refuse to believe anyone is shocked today.

[Gvac]

This couldnt make me happier. I love baseball but lets face it they all cheat. Who's next Pujols?

Absolutely.

There is no fucking way that guy doesn't juice.

No one gets that huge naturally. It's impossible.

[TheMojoPin]

Absolutely.

There is no fucking way that guy doesn't juice.

No one gets that huge naturally. It's impossible.

Or that he's as young as he claims to be.

[razorboy]

Absolutely.

There is no fucking way that guy doesn't juice.

No one gets that huge naturally. It's impossible.

Dwight Howard disagrees.

[FezsAssistant]

I would love to know who the other 103 players on the list are.

[Jose Canseco]

I DEMAND my kudos!!!!!!!

[Swannee]

Dwight Howard disagrees.

Dwight Howard wold look like a toothpick next to Pujols

[TheMojoPin]

And somehow Sammy Sosa remains a steroids-using mastermind.

The man is clearly not the brightest bulb in the box (see bat, corked), yet he keeps escaping these steroid revelations and doesn't have anyone claiming they knew he used or they got them for him or how he got them, etc..

He's a steroids idiot savant.

[Gvac]

I remember seeing Roger Clemens when he first came to the Yankees, and I was no more than 5 feet away from him. His forearms were literally the size of my thighs. I know some guys are naturally big, but there's no way someone becomes that freakishly huge without enhancement.

I had a friend years ago who was into bodybuilding and he said the forearms are the most difficult muscles to make massive, because there are so many groups of muscles there and we use them constantly so it's almost impossible to work them to failure. He said that was one of the easiest ways to spot a juicer, along with looking at their face. They'll either have zits or a "tightness" to their face, like the skin is stretched to it's limit.

[K.C.]

Talking about it on MLB Network right now.

[sailor]

I remember seeing Roger Clemens when he first came to the Yankees, and I was no more than 5 feet away from him. His forearms were literally the size of my thighs. I know some guys are naturally big, but there's no way someone becomes that freakishly huge without enhancement.

I had a friend years ago who was into bodybuilding and he said the forearms are the most difficult muscles to make massive, because there are so many groups of muscles there and we use them constantly so it's almost impossible to work them to failure. He said that was one of the easiest ways to spot a juicer, along with looking at their face. They'll either have zits or a "tightness" to their face, like the skin is stretched to it's limit.

is it roger's fault you got dame stems?

[razorboy]

Dwight Howard wold look like a toothpick next to Pujols

I have met both of them. Pujols is built like a trash bin. Howard has the most freakishly muscular physique I have ever seen in my life.

[K.C.]

I DEMAND my kudos!!!!!!!

Has Canseco missed yet? Everyone he's ever implicated has either been busted or is still under a cloud of doubt.

[Gvac]

is it roger's fault you got dame stems?

How DARE you!

[A.J.]

He said that was one of the easiest ways to spot a juicer, along with looking at their face. They'll either have zits or a "tightness" to their face, like the skin is stretched to it's limit.

They could always blame that on plastic surgery.

http://www.stefanitadio.com/uploaded_images/04-04-06-KennyRogers-750736.jpg

http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee103/autolos/Burt-Reynolds.jpg

[Gvac]

It's nothing short of jaw dropping how Kenny Rogers doesn't even resemble his former self in any way. He doesn't look altered; he looks like a completely different person.

[TheMojoPin]

What's the point of "busting" guys after the fact?

There were probably more guys using than not during the steroids era, and managers, upper management and the baseball front offices didn't give a rat's ass.

[joeyballsack]

What's the point of "busting" guys after the fact?

There were probably more guys using than not during the steroids era, and managers, upper management and the baseball front offices didn't give a rat's ass.

It certainly changes his HOF chances don't you think ? Up until this point he has been a first ballot lock, but I don't know now that he has this cloud of cheating hanging over him.

Add to that, the issue of credibility. He has claimed over and over that he has never had anything to do with steroids and that has been proven to be a lie. I don't see anything wrong with exposing people who lie to the fans.

[sailor]

It certainly changes his HOF chances don't you think ? Up until this point he has been a first ballot lock, but I don't know now that he has this cloud of cheating hanging over him.

Add to that, the issue of credibility. He has claimed over and over that he has never had anything to do with steroids and that has been proven to be a lie. I don't see anything wrong with exposing people who lie to the fans.

it was legal in the realm of baseball at the time he was alleged to have used it.

[K.C.]

All the steroids business seems to have originated from out of Oakland and Texas in the late 80s to late 90s, if you really think about the players that have been implicated all along.

So I know who I blame:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_W._Bush#Early_career

[joeyballsack]

it was legal in the realm of baseball at the time he was alleged to have used it.


He is going to be in the HOF. I just think this will keep the writers from making him a first ballot guy.

[K.C.]

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[sailor]

one thing that intrigues me, how did this not put him on the mitchell report? SI has better sources than that list? and did 4 people come out now at the same time or was SI sitting on the info for a while.

[Creeptub]

I think it's because those names were supposed to kept a secret. I hate when people can't keep secrets

[sailor]

I think it's because those names were supposed to kept a secret. I hate when people can't keep secrets

oh, uncle paul!

[Snoogans]

I wouldnt give a shit, being I think they all should be allowed to take whatever they want. But I hate fuckin liars:
"I've never felt overmatched on the baseball field. ... I felt that if I did my, my work as I've done since I was, you know, a rookie back in Seattle, I didn't have a problem competing at any level," he said on "60 Minutes."

that was his answer when he denied ever using PEDs

[brettmojo]

I DEMAND my kudos!!!!!!!

http://www.bewarethecheese.com/ca%20snickers%20kudos.jpg

It certainly changes his HOF chances don't you think ? Up until this point he has been a first ballot lock, but I don't know now that he has this cloud of cheating hanging over him.

Add to that, the issue of credibility. He has claimed over and over that he has never had anything to do with steroids and that has been proven to be a lie. I don't see anything wrong with exposing people who lie to the fans.

The only thing is that at this point it really is damaging to the game of baseball to keep having these stories coming out. These is completely a kick to the dick. Baseball is already doing what it can to clean up the game. There's really nothing more that Selig or anyone can do. This thing is only about getting a huge story breaking Arod's name as a steroid user. It's not to help clean up baseball. It's their job I understand but that's it. They didn't have any benevolet reason for putting out this story.

And fuck Selena Roberts right now for saying that the players should be pissed off about the tests not being destroyed. Fuck you you stupid bitch. You'd have no fucking story.

I think it's because those names were supposed to kept a secret. I hate when people can't keep secrets
SI should put there nosey asses to good use and start investigating Fez.

[Kevin]

SI better come out with every single name on that list.

[SP1!]

Whoulda thunk?

So wha does this say about ARod's numbers? They didn't drop off in the last 4 years, seems like this was probably a case of someone trying to stay off the DL. And weren't the results of the 2003 tests supposed to be kept secret?

Yeah I think most used steroids or HGH to stay off the DL, which is understandable but it appears bonds used it to get himself back in the limelight with mcguire and sosa, thats the kind of dick he is. I could almost forgive guys for using it to shorten time between injuries or nagging ones but to completely change someones abilities is what I have a problem with. Hell I have been trying to get HGH to heal my shoulder since rotator cuff sugeries are a pain in the ass to deal with, I dont see how any athlete comes back in under a year after those surgeries. It always made me wonder what they were taking.

They could always blame that on plastic surgery.

http://www.stefanitadio.com/uploaded_images/04-04-06-KennyRogers-750736.jpg

http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee103/autolos/Burt-Reynolds.jpg
That pic of kenny always sucks to see, you just know is young fucking ex wife made him get that done, thank god it didnt hurt his singing voice!!!!

[RingWraith]

At this point, I think A-Rod better have a press conference or something soon and just own up to what he did back then. Just admit it, apologize, and move on. Don't take the "Clemens Route" and deny everything.

[brettmojo]

Chad fuckin' Curtis? Really? Holy crap. How'd he get dragged into this?

[MC Pee Pants]

I cant wait to hear Steve Summers on the WFAN smash this guy. Lets go Mets.

[brettmojo]

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/8489/obamaxxxdk2.jpg (http://www.aprilwinchell.com/media/audio/OBAMA_THAT_GUY.mp3)

[cougarjake13]

so far i think all the names canseco has said have proved correct





so what are tommorrows headlines



a roid ???


a fraud ??

[Snoogans]

SI better come out with every single name on that list.

I love how all the Yankee fans automatically act like someone is somehow going after the Yankees with this. No one gives a fuck about the Yankees. This is about the player. Who has been most shit on with all this steroid stuff? No, it wasnt the YANKEE who ADMITTED he took them, Giambi, but Barry Bonds. Someone with NOTHING TO DO with the Yankees.

Please all yankee fans fuckin stop. No one is attacking you, no one is tryin to get dirt on only Yankees. It came out because of who ARod is, regardless of the logo on his shirt.



You guys really think you are that important that there is some grand conspiracy to try to take down Yankees?

[sailor]

who said yankee or yankees other than gvac (who was just saying he saw clemens when he came to the yankees) and you?

[brettmojo]

I love how all the Yankee fans automatically act like someone is somehow going after the Yankees with this.
Yeah, because one poster on a message board said something.

Whoever it was, if it was David Wright, Mets fans would want everyone else named as well.

I will say it's kinda' convenient this comes out now after all the bitching about the Yankees spending their FA money... Just sayin'.

[underdog]

I will say it's kinda' convenient this comes out now after all the bitching about the Yankees spending their FA money... Just sayin'.

Way to prove Snoogans right.

[Lividspiral]

its official: arod stinks and i dont like him. cheater cheater, pumpkin eater. if its not hookers its needles in the hiney. that guy is just a fraud. plus he cant hit in the clutch. every one of his home runs comes in may against the royals when the score is already 14-5. hit one in october against boston schmuck.

[spoon]

Siriusly? We're shocked? I really thought it was a given that he somehow escaped.

And just for equal time, I will also not be shocked (though somewhat more sad) if Youkilis' name comes up in all this.

But I refuse to believe anyone is shocked today.

I want Jeter and Mo to get brought in!

[spoon]

And somehow Sammy Sosa remains a steroids-using mastermind.

The man is clearly not the brightest bulb in the box (see bat, corked), yet he keeps escaping these steroid revelations and doesn't have anyone claiming they knew he used or they got them for him or how he got them, etc..

He's a steroids idiot savant.

Honestly, I believe it has a lot to do with the fact that Sammy was/is well liked and people aren't as out to get him. Let's be honest here, Clemens, Arod and Barry are three real top level assholes.

[spoon]

Has Canseco missed yet? Everyone he's ever implicated has either been busted or is still under a cloud of doubt.

Can't argue this. He may be a juiced asshole, but he seemingly isn't a liar.

[spoon]

http://www.bewarethecheese.com/ca%20snickers%20kudos.jpg



The only thing is that at this point it really is damaging to the game of baseball to keep having these stories coming out. These is completely a kick to the dick. Baseball is already doing what it can to clean up the game. There's really nothing more that Selig or anyone can do. This thing is only about getting a huge story breaking Arod's name as a steroid user. It's not to help clean up baseball. It's their job I understand but that's it. They didn't have any benevolet reason for putting out this story.

And fuck Selena Roberts right now for saying that the players should be pissed off about the tests not being destroyed. Fuck you you stupid bitch. You'd have no fucking story.


SI should put there nosey asses to good use and start investigating Fez.

You can't possibly believe that, or say this with a straight face.

[spoon]

SI better come out with every single name on that list.

Why?!

[spoon]

At this point, I think A-Rod better have a press conference or something soon and just own up to what he did back then. Just admit it, apologize, and move on. Don't take the "Clemens Route" and deny everything.

It's a good point too bc Arod had trouble in MLB/NY before this story. He's always been loopy and this may really hit him hard as opposed to Giambi laying low and not taking the Bonds DICKHEAD plan of attack.

This year in the stripes will be interesting to say the least. Perhaps CC will eat Arod in the dugout if they put him on a diet.....question is, would that be considered taking steroids?

[spoon]

I love how all the Yankee fans automatically act like someone is somehow going after the Yankees with this. No one gives a fuck about the Yankees. This is about the player. Who has been most shit on with all this steroid stuff? No, it wasnt the YANKEE who ADMITTED he took them, Giambi, but Barry Bonds. Someone with NOTHING TO DO with the Yankees.

Please all yankee fans fuckin stop. No one is attacking you, no one is tryin to get dirt on only Yankees. It came out because of who ARod is, regardless of the logo on his shirt.



You guys really think you are that important that there is some grand conspiracy to try to take down Yankees?

Seriously, you see both Kev (who ALWAYS bashs Arod) and bmojo hinting at this and acting as if it's just to hit the spanks. Give me a fucking break. I hope that report comes out and names like Jeter, Mo, Brosius (came from Oakland, possible supplier slash roid connection?)and O'Neal (would explain his irrational attitude and being a blazing asshole) are on it too. Along with the entire current YES crew and their wives.

[spoon]

Yeah, because one poster on a message board said something.

Whoever it was, if it was David Wright, Mets fans would want everyone else named as well.

I will say it's kinda' convenient this comes out now after all the bitching about the Yankees spending their FA money... Just sayin'.

oh God

poor yankee fans you are

[TheMojoPin]

Honestly, all this does is make me like ARod even more as a player.

[ChrisTheCop]

Honestly, all this does is make me like ARod even more as a player.

SHOCK POSTER!!!

[Kevin]

Seriously, you see both Kev (who ALWAYS bashs Arod) and bmojo hinting at this and acting as if it's just to hit the spanks. Give me a fucking break. I hope that report comes out and names like Jeter, Mo, Brosius (came from Oakland, possible supplier slash roid connection?)and O'Neal (would explain his irrational attitude and being a blazing asshole) are on it too. Along with the entire current YES crew and their wives.



1 he was not reallt directing that at me. 2 Like you said, i never liked Arod, and he did this as a Ranger, so i do not care. But its only fair that we see everyone on that list now. Even though he is a douche, its not fair that he is the only one outed when 103 others tested pos.

[ChrisTheCop]

But its only fair that we see everyone on that list now. Even though he is a douche, its not fair that he is the only one outed when 103 others tested pos.

Youre the guy who, when he gets a parking ticket, points to the other cars who are double parked and says, "What about THEM officer???!!!"

[Kevin]

Youre the guy who, when he gets a parking ticket, points to the other cars who are double parked and says, "What about THEM officer???!!!"



And they all should get tickets. DO YOUR JOB DONUT MAN

[Kevin]

And i don't care if more Yankees are on that list. I want to see every name on that list. SI's source was able to get Arod, they should be able to get the rest.

[ChrisTheCop]

And i don't care if more Yankees are on that list. I want to see every name on that list.

I'm glad you dont care, because.... wait for it.....

[Kevin]

I'm glad you dont care, because.... wait for it.....



If they did it, they deserve to be outed.

[TheMojoPin]

SHOCK POSTER!!!

I'd lay good money most players back then were doing something they shouldn't have, and coaches, trainers, management and the MLB front offices were looking the other way. Anyone who didn't take advantage of that was an idiot. I'm actually pissed at Ken Griffey, jr. for not taking them if just to keep him off the DL over his career. Steroids saved baseball, and cheating is a integral part of the game. I'm not going to arbitrarily act like this is so horrible compared to everything else, especially years after it actually happened.

[spoon]

If they did it, they deserve to be outed.

Are we talking secrets here!? Fez, Sheepy type shit?

[spoon]

I'd lay good money most players back then were doing something they shouldn't have, and coaches, trainers, management and the MLB front offices were looking the other way. Anyone who didn't take advantage of that was an idiot. I'm actually pissed at Ken Griffey, jr. for not taking them if just to keep him off the DL over his career. Steroids saved baseball, and cheating is a integral part of the game. I'm not going to arbitrarily act like this is so horrible compared to everything else, especially years after it actually happened.

Insanity is fun. :blink:

[Kevin]

Are we talking secrets here!? Fez, Sheepy type shit?



Shhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[ChrisTheCop]

Honestly, all this does is make me like ARod even more as a player.

I'd lay good money most players back then were doing something they shouldn't have, and coaches, trainers, management and the MLB front offices were looking the other way. Anyone who didn't take advantage of that was an idiot. I'm actually pissed at Ken Griffey, jr. for not taking them if just to keep him off the DL over his career. Steroids saved baseball, and cheating is a integral part of the game. I'm not going to arbitrarily act like this is so horrible compared to everything else, especially years after it actually happened.

A-Rod disagrees with you.
(also, katie couric mistates the mitchell report. I'm pretty sure it was all but ONE team. ahem.)
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[spoon]

A-Rod disagrees with you.
(also, katie couric mistates the mitchell report. I'm pretty sure it was all but ONE team. ahem.)
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Well it DOES look like they we're right on Clemens (really) being done, but they didn't factor in steroids via Canseco in Toronto and then in NY. Hell, I'm sure it didn't help him at all right mojo.

[underdog]

its official: arod stinks and i dont like him. cheater cheater, pumpkin eater. if its not hookers its needles in the hiney. that guy is just a fraud. plus he cant hit in the clutch. every one of his home runs comes in may against the royals when the score is already 14-5. hit one in october against boston schmuck.

Great post.

A-Rod disagrees with you.
(also, katie couric mistates the mitchell report. I'm pretty sure it was all but ONE team. ahem.)
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I don't get why people keep bringing up his conversation with Katie Couric. Why would he admit it? Who else has admitted they've taken steroids before getting caught?

[TheMojoPin]

Well it DOES look like they we're right on Clemens (really) being done, but they didn't factor in steroids via Canseco in Toronto and then in NY. Hell, I'm sure it didn't help him at all right mojo.

Of course it helped. That's why steroids fucking rule.

It's so cute how baseball gets singled out for steroids use, like use by its players is such a horrible thing, while basketball and football just skate on by. Yeah, keep thinking LeBron James is just a "perfect athletic specimen," or whatever else bullshit hyperbole gets shoveled his way.

Fuck the haters. Steroids, like all the other fitness and training evolutions over the years, make pro sports infinitely more awesome and entertaining. Guys stay off the DL and play longer, pitchers can throw harder and with a wider array of pitches and great hitters become even greater...MUY BUENO!

[MC Pee Pants]

Can we please not speak ill of Lebron?

[brettmojo]

I want Jeter and Mo to get brought in!

http://pics.livejournal.com/gomezticator/pic/0010ys4f

I'm sure he could pack away a lot of roids.

You can't possibly believe that, or say this with a straight face.

What else can they do that the player's union will allow them to? I'm not saying they couldn't test them for more, I'm saying that it's all they're able to do at right now. I'm sick of baseball getting fucking singled out anyway. Like football is so on top of shit. That's why players are dropping dead at 55.

Seriously, you see both Kev (who ALWAYS bashs Arod) and bmojo hinting at this and acting as if it's just to hit the spanks. Give me a fucking break. I hope that report comes out and names like Jeter, Mo, Brosius (came from Oakland, possible supplier slash roid connection?)and O'Neal (would explain his irrational attitude and being a blazing asshole) are on it too. Along with the entire current YES crew and their wives.

Fuck Arod... It took 6 years for this to surface? Could the people who leaked the info now had an ulterior motive? Could they be Brewers fans? Who the hell knows. All I said is that's convenient timing, or shitty timing whatever... Not saying fucking Lee Harvey Oswald fired the syringe into his ass for fucks sakes.

1 he was not reallt directing that at me. 2 Like you said, i never liked Arod, and he did this as a Ranger, so i do not care. But its only fair that we see everyone on that list now. Even though he is a douche, its not fair that he is the only one outed when 103 others tested pos.
Exactly. Being a Yankee isn't the issue.

[TheMojoPin]

Can we please not speak ill of Lebron?

Lebron rules. He's also probably using stuff he "shouldn't" be to enhance how much he rules.

[jauble]

Can we please not speak ill of Lebron?

He is still in Cleveland you know.

[epo]

He is still in Cleveland you know.

And he's probably staying there too.

[Snoogans]

Yeah, because one poster on a message board said something.

Whoever it was, if it was David Wright, Mets fans would want everyone else named as well.

I will say it's kinda' convenient this comes out now after all the bitching about the Yankees spending their FA money... Just sayin'.

How bout you read my post idiot. Most of what I referenced was all the people callin WFAN. Tons of them

[Snoogans]

Lebron rules. He's also probably using stuff he "shouldn't" be to enhance how much he rules.

I hope so

[KingGeno]

Oblig: And YET they still won't let Pete Rose back in......

[MC Pee Pants]

And he's probably staying there too.

If they win a title in the next two years I think he'll leave. That way he'll be forever loved in that city.

[brettmojo]

I love how all the Yankee fans automatically act like someone is somehow going after the Yankees with this. No one gives a fuck about the Yankees. This is about the player. Who has been most shit on with all this steroid stuff? No, it wasnt the YANKEE who ADMITTED he took them, Giambi, but Barry Bonds. Someone with NOTHING TO DO with the Yankees.

Please all yankee fans fuckin stop. No one is attacking you, no one is tryin to get dirt on only Yankees. It came out because of who ARod is, regardless of the logo on his shirt.



You guys really think you are that important that there is some grand conspiracy to try to take down Yankees?

How bout you read my post idiot. Most of what I referenced was all the people callin WFAN. Tons of them
Yeah, missed the pointing out of talking about WFAN there.

Oh wait, because there wasn't.

[A.J.]

Ya know, instead giving steroids to our athletes so they'll perform better, how's about we give some to this sluggish economy of ours!!!

http://www.otherlandtoys.co.uk/images/horn800.jpg

[joeyballsack]

A part of his new contract includes bonuses equalling 30 million for breaking six HR milestones.

Would this news affect the status of those bonuses now that the numbers are tainted by breaking league rules ?

[brettmojo]

A part of his new contract includes bonuses equalling 30 million for breaking six HR milestones.

Would this news affect the status of those bonuses now that the numbers are tainted by breaking league rules ?
Technically he hasn't broken any rules.

It wasn't illegal when this test took place. At least there was not penalty or whatever for it. And if he was still on the stuff he would have tested positive since.

So really he can continue being overpaid for being the greatest baseball player during the regular season ever.

[joeyballsack]

Technically he hasn't broken any rules.

It wasn't illegal when this test took place. At least there was not penalty or whatever for it. And if he was still on the stuff he would have tested positive since.

So really he can continue being overpaid for being the greatest baseball player during the regular season ever.



I am getting kind of annoyed with that argument because its wrong. It was both illegal to possess/use steroids without a doctors prescription and it was also against MLB rules to possess/use them without a prescription according to the following memo by then Commissioner Fay Vincent, written in 1991:

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/format/memos20051109?memo=1991&num=1

The lack of penalty or testing did not make it ok for him to do it.

I don't know if he is still on them or not, but I have to wonder why he was tipped off about an upcoming drug test in 2004 by Gene Orza. Why would they let him know about a test beforehand unless they thought there might be a reason he would fail that test ?

I am all for saying screw it, make them legal so everyone can take them. Its not my body and I really like seeing huge home runs so its a win/win for me. But this guy got caught cheating and is going to profit off of it and that I have a problem with.

[K.C.]

Technically he hasn't broken any rules.

It wasn't illegal when this test took place. At least there was not penalty or whatever for it. And if he was still on the stuff he would have tested positive since.

So really he can continue being overpaid for being the greatest baseball player during the regular season ever.

Apologist.


And seeing as how the Players Union has been outed as having tipped off players about the tests, no...it's not necessarily true he would have tested positive since if he was still using.

[TheMojoPin]

I am getting kind of annoyed with that argument because its wrong. It was both illegal to possess/use steroids without a doctors prescription and it was also against MLB rules to possess/use them without a prescription according to the following memo by then Commissioner Fay Vincent, written in 1991:

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/format/memos20051109?memo=1991&num=1

The lack of penalty or testing did not make it ok for him to do it.

It's false outrage to target any one player over getting caught or the Vincent memo. The Vincent memo might as well not exist. From 1994 to 2004, MLB did not give a crap about steroids. The front offices knew players were using left and right, the coaches and team mnagement and trainers all knew, and nothing was ever going to be enforced. Vincent's memo was meaningless, especially since it was moot with a doctor's prescription.

What does this all accomplish? Absolutely nothing. Each "revelation" way after the fact simple reinforces the idea that most of the noticeable players of the "steroids era" were using something. Anyone already in denial over that, well, that's their problem. Deal with it. It was an almost unavoidable part of baseball for at least a decade. Can we stop pretending to be shocked and "let down" by the painfully obvious?

[TheMojoPin]

Apologist.


And seeing as how the Players Union has been outed as having tipped off players about the tests, no...it's not necessarily true he would have tested positive since if he was still using.

Fuck it, the Player's Union owes him just for the clusterfuck of his name getting out. Why is that info around or available? It was an internal investigation to see if outside testing and scruitiny was needed when MLB finaly cracked down. The test results showed that. Why was that list still needed almost 6 years after the fact?

[TripleSkeet]

Canseco said AROD was doing juice when they were both with the Rangers. Once again, he was proven correct.

Yankee fans have to stop trying to justify it. We know for years alot of the league was on the juice. Just fucking accept it. The kid did juice. Clemens did it, Bonds did it, shit half the 93 starting Phillies did it. Everyone else has accepted it. Having an NY on his hat doesnt put him above any of those guys.

[Dan 'Hampton]

Well he looks contrite in the interview. Hah.
So he leaves TX, after failing a test, enters a clubhouse with guys like Sheffield and Giambi who were steroid users and he decided to give them up?

[Snoogans]

i love how now he says roids were "prevelant" when on 60 minutes he said he never saw anyone use it

[TheMojoPin]

i love how now he says roids were "prevelant" when on 60 minutes he said he never saw anyone use it

Of course he lied on 60 Minutes. At the time, everyone had been assured by the union and MLB that those 2003 test results weren't going to come out. Nobody was going to come forward and give things up. Canseco only did it to sell his book.

[Snoogans]

Of course he lied on 60 Minutes. At the time, everyone had been assured by the union and MLB that those 2003 test results weren't going to come out. Nobody was going to come forward and give things up. Canseco only did it to sell his book.

Yea I know. So you DONT DO THE FUCKIN INTERVIEW

[TheMojoPin]

Yea I know. So you DONT DO THE FUCKIN INTERVIEW

He's ARod. Like he's going to turn down an offer to let him talk on camera.

[joeyballsack]

Bravo for him finally admitting it.

After denying it repeatedly.

When he had already been caught.

I think there still has to be some kind of penalty. He admits to putting up tainted numbers for three years including one year in which he won an MVP award. I don't know if Carlos Delgado was on anything at the time, but if not, I wonder how he feels losing the 2003 MVP award to a guy who admits he cheated that year. I wonder how Hank Aaron feels about possibly surrendering one of the greatest achievements in sports to two guys who are cheats. I wonder how guys that decided to play the game without cheating and may be marginal HOF'ers will feel when ARod is put in the HOF and they are left out such as Fred Mcgriff, Dale Murphy, etc.

[Snoogans]

He's ARod. Like he's going to turn down an offer to let him talk on camera.

Which is exactly why I hate him. Take roids, I love you, act like you are above something you do, Scum

[TheMojoPin]

Bravo for him finally admitting it.

After denying it repeatedly.

When he had already been caught.

But he wasn't really "caught." The 2003 test was supposed to be secret and penalty-free. Thas' the only reason as many guys agreed to go aead with it and tested positive.

I think there still has to be some kind of penalty. He admits to putting up tainted numbers for three years including one year in which he won an MVP award. I don't know if Carlos Delgado was on anything at the time, but if not, I wonder how he feels losing the 2003 MVP award to a guy who admits he cheated that year.

ARod without steroids is still better than Delgado. And there can't be any penalty...it's stupid to arbitrarily penalize one guy for somthing 6 years after the fact that involves over a hundred other players from that test alone in an era when it's likely that thousands used.

I wonder how Hank Aaron feels about possibly surrendering one of the greatest achievements in sports to two guys who are cheats.

Fuck him. He broke it having access to things Ruth never did. And I love how people just assume Aaron didn't use anything, nevermind his career as a home run hitter was a bunch of the telltale signs we attribute to a guy like Bonds. (http://grg51.typepad.com/steroid_nation/2007/02/hammerin_hank_a.html) Everyone just smiles and thinks it's really nifty Aaron's home run numbers started blowing up at age 37. There's a good chance he was up to no good, too. At the very least he was likely popping speed like it was candy.

I wonder how guys that decided to play the game without cheating and may be marginal HOF'ers will feel when ARod is put in the HOF and they are left out such as Fred Mcgriff, Dale Murphy, etc.

What a ridiculous comparison. ARod without steroids is still light years ahead of those guys talent-wise. Again, fuck them. They're marginal for a reason. Them not using steroids, which can't be proven at this point, is no reason to reasses their HOF-worthiness.

[Snoogans]

That article is crazy. And I wouldnt be surprised in the slightest

[Snoogans]

i just watched a clip of ARod's interview, and he still looks like he is a phony. He just sits there tryin to think of what the safest thing to say is. BULLSHIT. He isnt sorry for anything but having his name come out

[joeyballsack]

Delgados numbers in 2003 were better pretty much across the board except for HR total which is now bogus.

Delgado
2003 TOR 0.302 161 570 117 172 38 1 42 145 109 137 0.426 0.593 1.019

ARod
2003 TEX 0.298 161 607 124 181 30 6 47 118 87 126 0.396 0.600 0.995

Delgado lost the MVP by 29 votes, so its not as if ARod was head and shoulders above him.

[Snoogans]

Delgados numbers in 2003 were better pretty much across the board except for HR total which is now bogus.

Delgado
2003 TOR 0.302 161 570 117 172 38 1 42 145 109 137 0.426 0.593 1.019

ARod
2003 TEX 0.298 161 607 124 181 30 6 47 118 87 126 0.396 0.600 0.995

Delgado lost the MVP by 29 votes, so its not as if ARod was head and shoulders above him.

And now we are positive that delgado didnt do roids?

[TheMojoPin]

Delgados numbers in 2003 were better pretty much across the board except for HR total which is now bogus.

Delgado
2003 TOR 0.302 161 570 117 172 38 1 42 145 109 137 0.426 0.593 1.019

ARod
2003 TEX 0.298 161 607 124 181 30 6 47 118 87 126 0.396 0.600 0.995

Delgado lost the MVP by 29 votes, so its not as if ARod was head and shoulders above him.

Meh. Who gives a shit? Delgado was probably on something himself at some point. Nobody can be assumed clean during that time except for Frank Thomas.

[Snoogans]

Meh. Who gives a shit? Delgado was probably on something himself at some point. Nobody can be assumed clean during that time except for Frank Thomas.

Come on man, Frank Thomas was obviously on roids. Remember how mad he got at his boss at the paper spinnin job in 94 during the strike. He was ready to beat him with a bat for not gettin a break

[TheMojoPin]

Come on man, Frank Thomas was obviously on roids. Remember how mad he got at his boss at the paper spinnin job in 94 during the strike. He was ready to beat him with a bat for not gettin a break

If he was on steroids, then he was the ballsiest, craziest motherfucker to ever use them because he was constantly screaming and practically putting people in headlock and demanding they test him. Dude was the only guy who WANTED to testify in front of Congress.

[Snoogans]

If he was on steroids, then he was the ballsiest, craziest motherfucker to ever use them because he was constantly screaming and practically putting people in headlock and demanding they test him. Dude was the only guy who WANTED to testify in front of Congress.

I just wanted to make a Married With Children joke

[TheMojoPin]

I just wanted to make a Married With Children joke

Frank was on MWC? How did I never see that?!?!

[Snoogans]

Frank was on MWC? How did I never see that?!?!

the episode where they started the nudy bar baseball league cause MLB was on strike. Piazza, Joe Morgan, Dave Winfield, Danny Tartabull, Frank Thomas, and Brett Saberhagen were all on

[joeyballsack]

I don't know, I guess one of the things I like about baseball is the ability to measure players against their peers based on the numbers for any given year. I am not even talking about comparing different era's, just being able to compare in a given season.

Shit like this makes that impossible.

You strike me as a smart guy Mojo, a smart baseball fan. Are you really cool with the fact that a guy who cheated is going to be in the HOF but someone like your boy Ron Santo doesn't make the cut ?

[brettmojo]

Canseco said AROD was doing juice when they were both with the Rangers. Once again, he was proven correct.

Yankee fans have to stop trying to justify it. We know for years alot of the league was on the juice. Just fucking accept it. The kid did juice. Clemens did it, Bonds did it, shit half the 93 starting Phillies did it. Everyone else has accepted it. Having an NY on his hat doesnt put him above any of those guys.

What are you talking about? Who's justifying it? All I said was there wasn't any penalty for the 2003 test.



I don't know if Carlos Delgado was on anything at the time, but if not, I wonder how he feels losing the 2003 MVP award to a guy who admits he cheated that year. I wonder how Hank Aaron feels about possibly surrendering one of the greatest achievements in sports to two guys who are cheats. I wonder how guys that decided to play the game without cheating and may be marginal HOF'ers will feel when ARod is put in the HOF and they are left out such as Fred Mcgriff, Dale Murphy, etc.

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i just watched a clip of ARod's interview, and he still looks like he is a phony. He just sits there tryin to think of what the safest thing to say is. BULLSHIT. He isnt sorry for anything but having his name come out
Of course not.

This is the same guy who fucked around on his wife in plain sight of the media.

[underdog]

I don't know, I guess one of the things I like about baseball is the ability to measure players against their peers based on the numbers for any given year. I am not even talking about comparing different era's, just being able to compare in a given season.

Shit like this makes that impossible.

You can still compare seasons as you could before. Inaccurately.

Baseball changes so much era to era. Half of the history of the league didn't include some great players because of their skin. Should we just throw out all records pre-1940s? (I say yes)

[hammersavage]

Every era seemingly had a way to cheat or uneven playing field. I don't judge these players too much differently.

[joeyballsack]

You can still compare seasons as you could before. Inaccurately.

Baseball changes so much era to era. Half of the history of the league didn't include some great players because of their skin. Should we just throw out all records pre-1940s? (I say yes)

Yeah, maybe I said it wrong but I am not concerned with comparing season to season. I was talking about being able to compare SS#1 who played in 2003 against SS#2 who also played in 2003, where there is no difference in the rules or equipment and the only difference should be in baseball ability.

[underdog]

Yeah, maybe I said it wrong but I am not concerned with comparing season to season. I was talking about being able to compare SS#1 who played in 2003 against SS#2 who also played in 2003, where there is no difference in the rules or equipment and the only difference should be in baseball ability.

You can still do that. It was a level playing field. Everyone was on steroids.

[TheMojoPin]

You can still do that. It was a level playing field. Everyone was on steroids.

Plus it's not a level playing field. Factors vary wildly from ballpark to ballpark and how they effect players' numbers. You really can't compare players to players accurately even in the same era. That's why people have come up with stuff like VORP.

I really just don't place that much stock into steroids creating a radically different player. The guys who hlt all the home runs do it because of their eye and skills at the plate...the steroids are just cake on top of that. A great player is a great player for most of their career...steroids doesn't create players like that.

[TheMojoPin]

I don't know, I guess one of the things I like about baseball is the ability to measure players against their peers based on the numbers for any given year. I am not even talking about comparing different era's, just being able to compare in a given season.

Shit like this makes that impossible.

You strike me as a smart guy Mojo, a smart baseball fan. Are you really cool with the fact that a guy who cheated is going to be in the HOF but someone like your boy Ron Santo doesn't make the cut ?

Like I've said before, cheating is a part of baseball. There are hundreds, probably thousands, of cheaters in the HOF right now. Take away the steroids, guys like Bonds, Clemens and ARod are still obviously so far ahead of the pack that, no, it doesn't bother me if they get in the HOF. It would bother me much more if they DON'T get in.

[FezsAssistant]

I'm glad Alex is being honest about it.
I'm still waiting for the other 103 names to be released.

[TheMojoPin]

I'm glad Alex is being honest about it.
I'm still waiting for the other 103 names to be released.

It would be a fucking joke if they were.

[joeyballsack]

I know it will never happen, but perhaps MLBPA should just go ahead and vote to release the names and get it over with.

I guess I am naive, but I don't think the majority of players are dirty.

[TheMojoPin]

I know it will never happen, but perhaps MLBPA should just go ahead and vote to release the names and get it over with.

I guess I am naive, but I don't think the majority of players are dirty.

But that's just it...the results of that test don't prove or disprove that idea. Nothing is served by releasing those names 6 years after the fact.

[K.C.]

And now we are positive that delgado didnt do roids?

I'm positive Delgado did do roids....last year...

[underdog]

I guess I am naive, but I don't think the majority of players are dirty.

You are.

As my wife, who knows nothing about sports and hates them said, "What kind of professional athlete wouldn't do everything they could to be the best?"

Do you really want to root for someone who only goes halfway? Vince Carter needs fans.

[Snoogans]

I'm positive Delgado did do roids....last year...

Id be with you there

[joeyballsack]

You are.

As my wife, who knows nothing about sports and hates them said, "What kind of professional athlete wouldn't do everything they could to be the best?"

Do you really want to root for someone who only goes halfway? Vince Carter needs fans.

I want to root for someone who does everything they can do within the rules, not someone who breaks them to be the best.

So would you be in favor of just throwing the rule book out the window ? Letting everyone do whatever steroid they want..toot a few lines of yayo before going out on the field, corking every bat ?

[spoon]

Of course he lied on 60 Minutes. At the time, everyone had been assured by the union and MLB that those 2003 test results weren't going to come out. Nobody was going to come forward and give things up. Canseco only did it to sell his book.

Of course?! You say this as if he HAD to go on national, no international tv, and lie bc he heard it was safe. I say bullshit. He knew damn well he took steroids, probably witnessed by people who need money more than he does right now, and it could eventually come out. Sorry, you just sit back and say nothing. I'm shocked by your acceptance of lies, cheating and your outright defense of them. I'm not saying like others that cheating hasn't been in MLB at different degrees over time, but to just act as if it doesn't matter is a strange/insane stance in my mind. How about we actually expect MLB to do what it says it is? How about the MLBPA actually protect the clean player versus those already at the top with money? The reason is obvious with both questions, but to see the fan just line up and follow orders as well shocks me. I'm glad the info was leaked, bc say what you want, even if these guys get into the HOF, they're tainted.

[underdog]

So would you be in favor of just throwing the rule book out the window ? Letting everyone do whatever steroid they want..toot a few lines of yayo before going out on the field, corking every bat ?

Yes.

Why the fuck do I care what they do with their bodies?

And the cocaine thing makes no sense. Why can't they do cocaine? It's not a P.E.D.

[underdog]

I'm glad the info was leaked, bc say what you want, even if these guys get into the HOF, they're tainted.

They should put them in the wing of the hall with the tainted players like Ty Cobb and Babe Ruth.

[TooLowBrow]

And the cocaine thing makes no sense. Why can't they do cocaine? It's not a P.E.D.

because its illegal?

[underdog]

because its illegal?

I just meant why would someone care if they player did cocaine.

[joeyballsack]

Yes.

Why the fuck do I care what they do with their bodies?

And the cocaine thing makes no sense. Why can't they do cocaine? It's not a P.E.D.

Neither are Ecstasy, GHB, marijuana or LSD but they are all on the banned substance list along with steroids. And in your world there are no rules, so Ferguson Jenkins, Alan Wiggins, Steve Howe, Willie Aikens, Willie Wilson, Jerry Martin, Vida Blue, Doc Gooden and Daryl Strawberry were among a few who should have never received suspensions .

[TheMojoPin]

Neither are Ecstasy, GHB, marijuana or LSD but they are all on the banned substance list along with steroids. And in your world there are no rules, so Ferguson Jenkins, Alan Wiggins, Steve Howe, Willie Aikens, Willie Wilson, Jerry Martin, Vida Blue, Doc Gooden and Daryl Strawberry were among a few who should have never received suspensions .

Damn right.

[spoon]

That article is crazy. And I wouldnt be surprised in the slightest

I've heard that rundown on Selig's ties to steroids in the past, but never put together the Davey Johnson piece. Interesting, and yet another reason for my deepening disdain for MLB and Selig alike. The biggest ego/arrogance in all of this is that of MLB's. I hope it all comes out, and I don't just mean the 2003 list. What about Rose now too? For fucks sake he looks like a cross-walker at this point.

[underdog]

Neither are Ecstasy, GHB, marijuana or LSD but they are all on the banned substance list along with steroids. And in your world there are no rules, so Ferguson Jenkins, Alan Wiggins, Steve Howe, Willie Aikens, Willie Wilson, Jerry Martin, Vida Blue, Doc Gooden and Daryl Strawberry were among a few who should have never received suspensions .

Absolutely.

[Ogre]

Yes.

Why the fuck do I care what they do with their bodies?

And the cocaine thing makes no sense. Why can't they do cocaine? It's not a P.E.D.

I beg to differ sir....While coke makes your pecker look like a button on a fur coat, it makes the ass move like the Energizer Bunny.

[joeyballsack]

Absolutely.


Fuck it..go Sox.

Hopefully Beckett is on something this year and doesn't show up like a fat slob like last year.

[spoon]

Fuck it..go Sox.

Hopefully Beckett is on something this year and doesn't show up like a fat slob like last year.

Maybe he was and forgot the workout part.

[SP1!]

They should put them in the wing of the hall with the tainted players like Ty Cobb and Babe Ruth.

Exactly why are cobb and ruth tainted, out side of their personal lives that is.

[TheMojoPin]

I've heard that rundown on Selig's ties to steroids in the past, but never put together the Davey Johnson piece. Interesting, and yet another reason for my deepening disdain for MLB and Selig alike. The biggest ego/arrogance in all of this is that of MLB's. I hope it all comes out, and I don't just mean the 2003 list. What about Rose now too? For fucks sake he looks like a cross-walker at this point.

He does? He willfully and repeatedly broke an ironclad rule that had been in place for the better part of a century. The best steroids has is a memo in the early 90's that everyone on every level baseball ignored or did nothing with. My blase nature of past steroids use in the past, I understand that they've cracked down now and I do agree active players caught NOW should be strongly punpished. What Rose did was never OK at any point in his career as a manager or a player.

[underdog]

Exactly why are cobb and ruth tainted, out side of their personal lives that is.

Because they played in a segregated era of baseball. Their stats are as inaccurate as the steroid era's stats are.

[RingWraith]

You know what A-Rod needs........Manny as a Yankee!!! :tongue:

[Knowledged_one]

Because they played in a segregated era of baseball. Their stats are as inaccurate as the steroid era's stats are.

that is retarded reasoning

[underdog]

that is retarded reasoning

At least Bonds and A-Rod are/were actually playing against all the greatest talent.

[TjM]

If it comes out any of the following players have used I will quit watching baseball

David Ortiz
Manny
Pedro
Jeter
Mo Rivera

[JPMNICK]

If it comes out any of the following players have used I will quit watching baseball

David Ortiz
Manny
Pedro
Jeter
Mo Rivera

i think there is a good chance ortiz or manny were using. I doubt jeter, but I would not be shocked about Mo or even Pedro, just to make their arm muscles recover faster

[TjM]

i think there is a good chance ortiz or manny were using. I doubt jeter, but I would not be shocked about Mo or even Pedro, just to make their arm muscles recover faster

Manny I highly doubt

[TheGameHHH]

Manny I highly doubt

take a look at skinny Manny from his Cleveland days and Manny now

[TjM]

take a look at skinny Manny from his Cleveland days and Manny now



Yeah but his numbers never fluctuated. Plus he looks more doughy than ripped. Also weight gain soes not automatically mean steroids

[midwestjeff]

This Arod thing has really got me thinking.

Imagine if McGwire had used steriods too.

I bet he could have hit a good 90-95 HR's a year.

[epo]

Manny I highly doubt

take a look at skinny Manny from his Cleveland days and Manny now

Manny is actually one of the first people I thought of.

[brettmojo]

The rest of that list needs to come out just so the speculation can stop.

[Knowledged_one]

At least Bonds and A-Rod are/were actually playing against all the greatest talent.

the difference is that the players chose to use ped while cobb and ruth had no choice in who they played

[zildjian361]

Shit i know Bruce made the cover of Time and Newsweek, back in 75, but A-Rod was on the cover of every paper in the US the last 2 day's. Can he make the Cover of The Rolling Stone::unsure:

[boosterp]

I am so sick of A-Rod

[meanmrbill]

I haven't watched a baseball game in over 10 years. This A-Rod shit just fortifies my stance against the sport. Of course, living so close to the awful Pirates' franchise also contributes to my hatred of baseball.

[lleeder]

As a creator of bad threads I can honestly say this is the worst.

[spoon]

the difference is that the players chose to use ped while cobb and ruth had no choice in who they played

Agreed.

Stop making every and any excuse for known cheaters. I'll speculate on those linked, but until then I'll save it. Sorry, all those attached are forever labeled cheats and even if Joe Carter himself got linked, I'd hate him. Enough of looking at this from a who cares attitude and let's push/hope the game takes the Olympic angle on this moving forward. Fuck you Selig for somehow hurting baseball at every turn of late. You too MLBPA.

[SP1!]

Because they played in a segregated era of baseball. Their stats are as inaccurate as the steroid era's stats are.

At least Bonds and A-Rod are/were actually playing against all the greatest talent.

Fucking please, that is the weakest argument of all time. Besides the greatness of quite a few of those players is highly questionable.

[underdog]

the difference is that the players chose to use ped while cobb and ruth had no choice in who they played

You don't think if a player of Ruth's caliber stood up about segregation in baseball that something might have changed?

[underdog]

Fucking please, that is the weakest argument of all time

If you're saying that, I'm pretty pleased with my stance.

[spoon]

You don't think if a player of Ruth's caliber stood up about segregation in baseball that something might have changed?

While I'm not on board with a lot of SP1's arguments... I can confidently state that NO, nothing would have changed at that point in time.

[Knowledged_one]

You don't think if a player of Ruth's caliber stood up about segregation in baseball that something might have changed?

not a chance back then the owners actually ruled things not the players

[underdog]

While I'm not on board with a lot of SP1's arguments... I can confidently state that NO, nothing would have changed at that point in time.

You're probably right. But I really wonder if Ruth threatening to walk away would have effected the league.

[SP1!]

You don't think if a player of Ruth's caliber stood up about segregation in baseball that something might have changed?
No, you have to remember this was the time when Ty Cobb was an open racist and no one really cared.

If you're saying that, I'm pretty pleased with my stance.I wouldnt be, you have virtually nothing to base that argument on.

You're probably right. But I really wonder if Ruth threatening to walk away would have effected the league.Wouldnt have made one bit of difference, they would have set someone else up as the star, look how quick they shoved him out when he declined a little. He was hated in the league, they wouldnt even let him coach after he left.

[Knowledged_one]

The owners cared so little about the players they let them train WW1 soldiers on how to put gas masks on using real poison gas

[hammersavage]

The owners cared so little about the players they let them train WW1 soldiers on how to put gas masks on using real poison gas

So you're saying those were the days, eh?

[vjr97]

how gives a shit!!!! yankees rule!!! they drank every fucking day in the 20,30,40,50,60's yet they still manage to play? amph and what ever the fuck elese they had back then

[spoon]

how gives a shit!!!! yankees rule!!! they drank every fucking day in the 20,30,40,50,60's yet they still manage to play? amph and what ever the fuck elese they had back then

GREAT POINT!

And how gives a shit about anything. Burn everything! Burn!

Fucking swingline staplers for all.

[Knowledged_one]

Who's how

[TheMojoPin]

What I get out of the whole "they played in segregated leagues" thing is that it's just yet another reason why I don't get worked up over these records because of how differnt the contexts are for the various eras of baseball. The circumstances behind who set them and when they're broken are so radically different that it just ends up being something that nobody can compare directly. There's always multiple significant things that make such comparisons null, cheating or otherwise.

[TheMojoPin]

The rest of that list needs to come out just so the speculation can stop.

Why would that stop any speculation? That wasn't a comprehensive test and was only indicative of that particular moment in time.

[JimBeam]

I don't get why the records for the early part of the 20th century are held w/ such high regard and it's a sin to question them.

We know for a fact that one team tanked a series for money so who's to say that wasn't more common place than we'd think.

For all we know Babe Ruth was the Hulk Hogan of his era and everything was setup to make him great to draw the fans.

All total speculation and conspiracy theory but I don't think that anybody could say for certain that there weren't shennanigans back then.

[ladyface]

A-Rod = J-Tuck (http://www.thatsnotfake.com/)

[brettmojo]

Why would that stop any speculation? That wasn't a comprehensive test and was only indicative of that particular moment in time.
I just meant for the list itself, not players in general.

[zildjian361]

As a creator of bad threads I can honestly say this is the worst.

then read it and move on dickhead

[underdog]

What I get out of the whole "they played in segregated leagues" thing is that it's just yet another reason why I don't get worked up over these records because of how differnt the contexts are for the various eras of baseball. The circumstances behind who set them and when they're broken are so radically different that it just ends up being something that nobody can compare directly. There's always multiple significant things that make such comparisons null, cheating or otherwise.

That was the point I was unsuccessfully trying to make.

[TheMojoPin]

That was the point I was unsuccessfully trying to make.

Then you get into the very arguable idea that Negro League players actually broke Ruth's HR record, and that they arguably faced much better pitching, too.

[cougarjake13]

theres too many variables in all of it

different era's
players of color not allowed to play
who did or didnt take anything

[underdog]

Then you get into the very arguable idea that Negro League players actually broke Ruth's HR record, and that they arguably faced much better pitching, too.

I personally think that if Ruth actually had to play in a non-segregated league, he would have averaged less than 10 home runs a year. If he were born in the 80s and playing today, he would have been born with a vagina. As would have all the Yankees from the 20s.

[TheMojoPin]

Ruth was an awesome player, but he also showed up at an odd time in baseball. Most still viewed the home run as something that was unsportsmanlike if you just piled them on and most of the players that could hit a lot them actualy tried not to do it unless it was "necessary". Cobb is the best example of that...if Cobb actually tried to hit home runs, the HR record likely would have been his ad might still be his. After Ruth showed up, Cobb would mock him and tell the press he could hit HR's too. Sure enough, Cobb would spend the next couple of games belting out home runs and then talked like that proved that Ruth was a lesser player because he couldn't also hack it with the small ball as amazing as Cobb did. God only knows what the HR numbers of a guy like Cobb would look like if he had cut loose.

[Knowledged_one]

Cobb led the league a few years in hr with like 8 and 9.
his autobiography is a pretty good read

[TheMojoPin]

Cobb led the league a few years in hr with like 8 and 9.
his autobiography is a pretty good read

It's sick what his slugging numbers are. Look at all those triples and doubles. There's little doubt in my mind he could have been hitting more home runs than anyone if he had wanted to. The ma could basically will the ball where he wanted it to go.

Looking at his stats, '21 and '25 are probably the seasons where he opted to hit home runs for a week or so to show that "anyone could do it."

[lleeder]

Ruth was an awesome player, but he also showed up at an odd time in baseball. Most still viewed the home run as something that was unsportsmanlike if you just piled them on and most of the players that could hit a lot them actualy tried not to do it unless it was "necessary". Cobb is the best example of that...if Cobb actually tried to hit home runs, the HR record likely would have been his ad might still be his. After Ruth showed up, Cobb would mock him and tell the press he could hit HR's too. Sure enough, Cobb would spend the next couple of games belting out home runs and then talked like that proved that Ruth was a lesser player because he couldn't also hack it with the small ball as amazing as Cobb did. God only knows what the HR numbers of a guy like Cobb would look like if he had cut loose.

People in the olden days were queer. I can explain that further but you get it.

[Knowledged_one]

The man was amazing how he analyzed pitchers pick off moves, the different slides he would use depending on the situation and his theories on hitting.
and if not for cheap owners would have won a ton of titles. And then went on to make a ton of money investing in coca cola

[brettmojo]

What everyone has been waiting for... John Cena's perspective.

-- What happened with Alex Rodriguez and the steroids revelations sickened him. He thinks if everyone really wants to get serious about cleaning up the game, "they should send the guys to jail." As for steroids, Cena understands why his incredible physique (http://www.lordsofpain.net/news/wwe/901.html#) may draw some steroid speculation. "I'm not only a guy who will say I'm clean, but I'll beat my chest to the world that I'm clean," he said. "I have very, very strong opinions on that."

[razorboy]

What everyone has been waiting for... John Cena's perspective.

A professional wrestler speaking out about steroid use. Fucking brilliant. I need to go take ten minutes on my heavy bag.

[brettmojo]

Bump for the news conference.

I'm really sick of hearing people say,"WHY DIDN'T HE ADMIT TO IT BEFORE HE GOT CAUGHT IF HE WAS REALLY REMORSEFUL?"

WHO THE FUCK DOES THAT?!? The only reason to apologize for anything is getting caught. Whether or not you're truly sorry for something depends on what you do after the fact to make up for it.

[brettmojo]

Girardi still looks like he can play.

[JimBeam]

The only reason to apologize for anything is getting caught. Whether or not you're truly sorry for something depends on what you do after the fact to make up for it.

Yeah but then people have to stop saying that he admitted that he took steroids.

No he basically confirmed what we alread knew thanks to the article.

He's no hero for admitting it after he was caught.

[brettmojo]

He's no hero for admitting it after he was caught.
Agreed.

[Dan 'Hampton]

So he starts earning a 200 million+ contract and decides it's a good idea to start using something that he knows nothing about that his cousin gets over the counter in the DR? And when does he end up appologizing for what he miss-states in this press conference?

[cougarjake13]

So he starts earning a 200 million+ contract and decides it's a good idea to start using something that he knows nothing about that his cousin gets over the counter in the DR? And when does he end up appologizing for what he miss-states in this press conference?

and then allegedly stops when leaves the pressure cooker of texas for new york

[razorboy]

and then allegedly stops when leaves the pressure cooker of texas for new york

I don't even think that is the larger point. Once you signed a guaranteed contract what pressure is there?

[cougarjake13]

I don't even think that is the larger point. Once you signed a guaranteed contract what pressure is there?

cause if he spent the 10 yrs in texas and put up huge numbers then no one would prob say much, other than he performed to or out performed his contract



in yankee land i dont think they'd care if he hit only 20-25 hrs a year as long as he was clutch in the playoffs and brought home world series rings

[JimBeam]

He opened more questions than he answered I think.

He was young and made bad choices at 27 ?

When the hell does he think you should start making good ones ? When you're 50 ?

I also like how he makes it seem that if he went to college he'd have matured better.

So does that mean any MLB player that didn't go to college has an excuse for using steroids or PEDs ?

[Pestz4Evah]

A-Rod took steroids while with Yankees, and as teen, claims new book (http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2009/04/29/2009-04-29_arod_on_roids_for_years_new_book_claims_juiced_ with_yanks__even_as_a_teen_source.html)

Sports Illustrated writer Selena Roberts, who broke the story that A-Rod flunked a steroid screening in 2003, reveals fellow Bombers nicknamed the third baseman "Bitch Tits" in 2005.

That was after he put on 15pounds in the off-season and seemed to develop round pectorals, a condition called gynecomastia that can be caused by anabolic steroids, she writes.

In addition, an unnamed major-leaguer is quoted as saying Rodriguez and steroid-tainted pitcher Kevin Brown were seen together with human growth hormone - HGH - in 2004.

Brown, who was named in the Mitchell Report on steroids, denied through a lawyer that he ever shared the hormone with the highest-paid player in baseball.

Two other anonymous Yankees said they believed A-Rod was using based on side effects they saw - and a clubhouse staffer said management wondered if he was using banned substances.

"No one ever asked Alex directly that I know of, but there was a lot of suspicion in house," the employee is quoted as saying.

Jose Canseco, an ex-teammate and friend of Rodriguez who accused him of steroid abuse even before last year, believes A-Rod was on 'roids in pinstripes.

"I absolutely think Alex is using HGH," he said. "Probably a combination of growth and steroids."

Canseco said he believes Rodriguez's steroid use goes back to his teens, when he was a high school standout in Miami.

"Was he on steroids in high school?" he said. "I think probably so. I worked out with him when he was 18. He could lift almost as much as I could."

Rodriguez put on 25 pounds of muscle between his sophomore and junior years, and word was that his connection was a dog kennel owner.

In one shocking disclosure, the book accuses A-Rod of "pitch tipping" when he was with the Rangers - letting a friendly opponent at the plate know which pitch was coming in lopsided games.

Rodriguez expected players he helped would do the same for him when he was having an off night and needed to get his batting average up and it wouldn't affect the outcome of the game.

The 255-page book also chronicles A-Rod's off-the-field escapades: his poker habit; his divorce from his wife, Cynthia; the relationship with Madonna, and dalliances with out-of-town floozies.

He was even hated at Hooters, where he tipped the minimum 15%, the book says.

[A.J.]

Sports Illustrated writer Selena Roberts, who broke the story that A-Rod flunked a steroid screening in 2003, reveals fellow Bombers nicknamed the third baseman "Bitch Tits" in 2005.

Oh, I can't wait for his first game in Boston.

[brettmojo]

Still don't care.

[drjoek]

Still don't care.

X 2

[underdog]

Still don't care.

X 2

As a Red Sox fan, it's hilarious to see. But I really don't give a fuck about players using steroids.

[foodcourtdruide]

If he did steroids as a Texas Ranger it's ok, but if he insulted the magical spotless history of the legendary and class-filled NEW YORK YANKEES , then he's a disgrace to baseball.

[vjr97]

another hyper competative athelete did p.e.ds. so fucking what if u can walk away a millionare in the end : hurray!!

[Gvac]

I think he's a homosexual who hasn't come to grips with it yet.

You'll see.

[The End]

I think he's a homosexual who hasn't come to grips with it yet.

You'll see.

I have been saying this for years. I also feel Jeter was his lover and thus the rift between them, because A-Rod didn't embrace his love and got married so he wouldn't be ridiculed

[Gvac]

I have been saying this for years. I also feel Jeter was his lover and thus the rift between them, because A-Rod didn't embrace his love and got married so he wouldn't be ridiculed

Interesting theory, and quite probable.

You and I are going to be good friends, End...I have a hunch.

[The End]

Interesting theory, and quite probable.

You and I are going to be good friends, End...I have a hunch.

Maybe we have been in another life as well

[Snoogans]

this guy The End is skyrocketing up the charts. Keep up the good work.....I cant wait til the sox fans get to do their new chant

BITCH TITS.......BITCH TITS......BITCH TITS

[razorboy]

I couldn't care less about steroid use, but tipping pitches to the opposition is despicable and unforgivable.

[hammersavage]

Phil Mickelson is gonna be pissed someone stole his nickname.

[Snoogans]

I love the tiopping pitches is unforgivable. FUCK THAT. The reason it doesnt happen is cause you will have a fastball come at your head if they catch you. But its a part of the game and has been from the beginning. Same as if you celebrate too much, a ball comes at your head. If you are willin to duck a couple, then you can steal signs.

This respectability in sports is fine in HS and College and younger years, fine. This is pro ball. I talked with spoon on this about flopping and shit. Its a multimillion dollar industry and you are paid to win games, not be a good guy. Fuck it. Just win, baby

[razorboy]

I love the tiopping pitches is unforgivable. FUCK THAT. The reason it doesnt happen is cause you will have a fastball come at your head if they catch you. But its a part of the game and has been from the beginning. Same as if you celebrate too much, a ball comes at your head. If you are willin to duck a couple, then you can steal signs.

This respectability in sports is fine in HS and College and younger years, fine. This is pro ball. I talked with spoon on this about flopping and shit. Its a multimillion dollar industry and you are paid to win games, not be a good guy. Fuck it. Just win, baby

But why tip pitches TO THE FUCKING OPPOSITION?

[Snoogans]

But why tip pitches TO THE FUCKING OPPOSITION?

no i corrected that, i just fucked up talkin, he would tip pitches to his guys. But not to win. Just so they would do it back to him so he could pad his stats. Id love him so much more if it was to the other teams, but i just fucked up there

[joeyballsack]

I bet the pitching staff has to love the idea of him tipping pitches to the opposition.

Its a great way to endear yourself to your team mates.

[Snoogans]

jesus i said right after i slipped, he didnt tip them to the other team.

[foodcourtdruide]

Maybe my reading comprehension is terrible, but the article says he DID tip to the other team:

In one shocking disclosure, the book accuses A-Rod of "pitch tipping" when he was with the Rangers - letting a friendly opponent at the plate know which pitch was coming in lopsided games.

[hammersavage]

Bitch tits tipped to the other team hoping they would do the same when he batted.

How can you even tip pitches to your team?

[razorboy]

RonFez.net can help Bitch Tits.

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c297/razorboy_/ghj.jpg

[jessicaduh]

hahahahaha

[Snoogans]

Maybe my reading comprehension is terrible, but the article says he DID tip to the other team:

In one shocking disclosure, the book accuses A-Rod of "pitch tipping" when he was with the Rangers - letting a friendly opponent at the plate know which pitch was coming in lopsided games.

holy fuck. That part wasnt in the article I read. I read he tipped his teammates hoping they return the favor. AHAHAHAHA

I wonder if it was Jeter he tipped?

[Kevin]

Bitch tits tipped to the other team hoping they would do the same when he batted.

How can you even tip pitches to your team?



When you are at SS you see your catchers signs easy. Just tell the other guy, i will do this when its a FB, or this when its a curve.. easy.

[hammersavage]

It's not even tipping when its your own teammate. It's just baseball.


Try going a day without smoking.

[hammersavage]

When you are at SS you see your catchers signs easy. Just tell the other guy, i will do this when its a FB, or this when its a curve.. easy.

What? So there would be a problem if ARod was playing short, saw the pitch, and told the 3rd baseman on his own team?

[Snoogans]

It's not even tipping when its your own teammate. It's just baseball.


Try going a day without smoking.

most people call it tipping and stealing signs even when your team is hitting. I dont think its a problem, but some people think its outrageous

[hammersavage]

He's like Bobby Thompson

[joeyballsack]

most people call it tipping and stealing signs even when your team is hitting. I dont think its a problem, but some people think its outrageous

I don't think anyone has a problem with that, its him fucking his pitchers in the ass, tipping their pitches to the opposing team for favors when he is up that seems pretty damn shady.

[Snoogans]

I don't think anyone has a problem with that, its him fucking his pitchers in the ass, tipping their pitches to the opposing team for favors when he is up that seems pretty damn shady.

i agree. Is ARod the biggest scum bag ever? Every month it seems something comes out and makes him a BIGGER dick

[hammersavage]

They do look 'bitchy'

http://subwaychatter.com/blog/images/arodgay.jpg

[Snoogans]

They do look 'bitchy'

http://subwaychatter.com/blog/images/arodgay.jpg

WHAT THE FUCK. Where is this shit from?

[joeyballsack]

i agree. Is ARod the biggest scum bag ever? Every month it seems something comes out and makes him a BIGGER dick

Even though he is starting to make Pete Rose look like a choir boy, he will still get into the HOF.

[hammersavage]

WHAT THE FUCK. Where is this shit from?

My dreams.
It looks like Biff Henderson from Letterman rubbing him down.


Along with this infamous one, how is this not a sig pic already:

http://www.shoppingblog.com/pics/arod_kissing_mirror.jpg

[brettmojo]

I think he's a homosexual who hasn't come to grips with it yet.

You'll see.

Wishful thinking?

I wonder if it was Jeter he tipped?
I hear it was more than just the tip, knuck knuck...

[TheMojoPin]

i agree. Is ARod the biggest scum bag ever? Every month it seems something comes out and makes him a BIGGER dick

The greatest sports figures are always also the greatest assholes. We just discussed that here recently.