Duke Rape Case DNA

[led37zep]

<p>None of the DNA in the strippers underwear matches the Duke Lacross Players.&nbsp; What will Earl say now?</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>http://apnews.myway.com/article/20061213/D8M06MS80.html&nbsp;</p>

[johnniewalker]

I think this one is going to fade away.&nbsp;&nbsp; The DA got reelected, he can stop messing with the black community and holding town house rallys saying these kids are guilty.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; What is this the 1700's? &nbsp;&nbsp;

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by johnniewalker on 12-14-06 @ 2:07 PM</span>

[furie]

Earl denies the OJ DNA evidence, why would this impress him?

[EliSnow]

<p><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="3">SI is reporting that the accuser is about to give birth, and that the defense just filed a motion for the court to throw out evidence of the accuser's identification of the defendants in a line-up:</font></p><p><a href="http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/more/12/15/duke.lacrosse.ap/index.html?cnn=yes">http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/more/12/15/duke.lacrosse.ap/index.html?cnn=yes</a></p>

[Yerdaddy]

<p>DNA in the strippers underwear </p><p>That's as far as I got in this thread. What were we talking about again?</p>

[nate1000]

<p>&quot;DNA testing that found genetic material from several males in the accuser's body and her underwear -- but none from any member of the lacrosse team.&quot;</p><p>I can't figure out why this case has not yet been dismissed and a public apology has net been issued by the DA. </p>

[Fezticle98]

This thread should be stickied.

[sailor]

<strong>nate1000</strong> wrote:<br /><p>&quot;DNA testing that found genetic material from several males in the accuser's body and her underwear -- but none from any member of the lacrosse team.&quot;</p><p>I can't figure out why this case has not yet been dismissed and a public apology has net been issued by the DA. </p><p>&nbsp;<font size="2">maybe fez will do a public apology today?<br /></font></p>

[JimBeam]

<p>I saw something on the tv last night about a baby</p><p>Some family member says she's pregnant as of 9 months ago</p>

[Fezticle98]

<strong>JimBeam</strong> wrote:<br /><p>I saw something on the tv last night about a baby</p><p>Some family member says she's pregnant as of 9 months ago</p><p>Wow! Who saw THAT coming?</p><p>I think it would be bigger news if that cum dumpster wasn't pregnant.</p>

[EliSnow]

<strong>nate1000</strong> wrote:<br /><p>&quot;DNA testing that found genetic material from several males in the accuser's body and her underwear -- but none from any member of the lacrosse team.&quot;</p><p>I can't figure out why this case has not yet been dismissed and a public apology has net been issued by the DA. </p><p><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="3">The answer is that it is possible for the defendants to have taken part in a rape of the victim without leaving any DNA, i.e. they used condoms or didn't ejaculate.&nbsp;&nbsp; The DNA found could be from other persons who raped the woman (assuming she was raped).&nbsp; I believe her story is that there were more than just the three defendants. </font></p><p><font face="Arial" size="3">With regard to the absence of DNA from these players, the DA once said that they were able to convict guilty parties for years without DNA evidence, so it's not necessary to have it.&nbsp; The DA's position is tenuous, I think, but enough to keep the case.&nbsp; </font></p><p><font face="Arial" size="3">We'll see how it goes with the latest motion.&nbsp; If the Defendants win on that, it's all over.&nbsp; </font></p>

[JimBeam]

<p>Yeah but how convenient it is to use DNA to accuse somebody of something but not to use it as an alibi</p><p>If its so unreliable why are so many innocent people being freed from jail ?</p><p>My understanding is no condoms were found.</p><p>Plus wouldnt there have been trace evidence of some type of spermacide if they used them ?</p>

[EliSnow]

<strong>JimBeam</strong> wrote:<br /><p>Yeah but how convenient it is to use DNA to accuse somebody of something but not to use it as an alibi</p><p>If its so unreliable why are so many innocent people being freed from jail ?</p><p>My understanding is no condoms were found.</p><p>Plus wouldnt there have been trace evidence of some type of spermacide if they used them ?</p><p><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="3">As to your first point, it would be an alibi, if she said she was raped by three guys, and they found three DNA samples that didn't match any of the defendants.&nbsp; In this case, I believe she said&nbsp;that&nbsp;she was raped by&nbsp;more than three men.&nbsp;&nbsp;As a result, the samples suggest innocence by don't absolutely prove it.</font></p><p><font face="Arial" size="3">As to your second point, I wasn't saying that DNA is unreliable.&nbsp; It's reliable to identfy with almost perfect acccuracy a person who has left a biological sample.&nbsp;In the cases you reference, the victim claimed to have been raped by one male, and the sample from the lone rapist didn't match who was convicted.&nbsp; As a result, the convicted person was cleared.&nbsp; Again, a different case from this one.</font></p><p><font face="Arial" size="3">As for no condoms being found, that is also not conclusive evidence.&nbsp;&nbsp;Very persuasive&nbsp;yes, but not conclusive, because guys could have disposed of them in some way so that they weren't found.&nbsp; The fact that they weren't found doesn't mean they don't exist.</font></p><p><font face="Arial" size="3">As for spermacide, this is a very good point, but do all condoms use spermacide?&nbsp; I didn't think they do, but it's been awhile since I've needed them.&nbsp; </font></p><p><font face="Arial" size="3">Again, I think the DAs position is tenuous, but right now, I think he could survive a motion to dismiss.&nbsp; </font></p>

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by EliSnow on 12-15-06 @ 11:47 AM</span>

[EliSnow]

<p><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="3">I've been reading some more about this on cnn.com:</font></p><p><a href="http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/12/15/duke.lacrosse.ap/index.html">http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/12/15/duke.lacrosse.ap/index.html</a></p><p><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="3">The more I read, the more I think this case will not be going to trial.&nbsp; First I read:</font></p><p><font face="Arial" size="1">News of the accuser's pregnancy comes roughly nine months after the team party where she says she was raped by three men, but District Attorney District Attorney Mike Nifong said he believed the accuser became pregnant at least two weeks after the party.</font><font face="Arial" size="3">&nbsp;</font></p><p><font face="Arial" size="3">Next:</font></p><p><font size="1">Medical records included in a defense motion filed Thursday were not made public, but Cheshire said the woman was given a pregnancy test immediately after reporting she was raped -- and it was negative -- and she took an emergency contraceptive.</font></p><p><font size="3"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If this is true (and the test she took would have detected a pregnancy), then she had to get pregnant afterwards.</font>&nbsp; </font></p><p><font face="Arial"><font size="3">Now, I'll keep an open mind, and clearly I'm relying upon information from the press, but if all of this is true,&nbsp;I have trouble believing that&nbsp;a woman who has gone through a traumatic event like gang rape would have sex two weeks after the event.&nbsp; And I can easily see a jury finding a lack of credibility to her story on this basis alone.</font>&nbsp;&nbsp;</font></p>

[JimBeam]

<p>I wasnt questioning your opinion more of an overthought as I had heard the DA say that the lack of DNA doesnt mean a crime didnt occur.</p><p>The point I'm trying to make is if we let a guy out of prison because we find other DNA or lack of his DNA at a crime scene how do we know he just didnt leave any ?</p><p>I'm thinking that all condoms would have some type of chemical whether it be spermicide or something else.</p><p>Outside of the kid coming out Chinese I'm not sure how her being pregnant helps the defense.</p><p>Even if she got knocked up the next day that doesnt mean she couldnt have still been raped.</p>

[Snacks]

How can they not just drop this case alreay? This is becoming a disaster and the DA should lose his job over how he has handled this.

[EliSnow]

<strong>JimBeam</strong> wrote:<br /><p>The point I'm trying to make is if we let a guy out of prison because we find other DNA or lack of his DNA at a crime scene how do we know he just didnt leave any ?</p><p><font size="3">I've never heard of a guy being released because they didn't find any DNA.&nbsp; It's usually they have DNA from one person, the victim says only one person raped her, and the DNA is not from the person accused or convicted.&nbsp;&nbsp; If there is only one person, and the DNA from the one rapist doesn't match, that pretty much rules out the accused.</font></p><p>Outside of the kid coming out Chinese I'm not sure how her being pregnant helps the defense.</p><p>Even if she got knocked up the next day that doesnt mean she couldnt have still been raped.</p><p><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="3">It helps the defense because people may see the fact that she was&nbsp;willing to have sex two weeks after the alleged incident as evidence that she wasn't raped.&nbsp;&nbsp;Rape is a traumatic event, and it often inhibits the person for a long time from voluntarily having sex, because the act reminds the victim of being raped.&nbsp;&nbsp; Gang rape is even worse.&nbsp; </font></p>

[cougarjake13]

<strong>EliSnow</strong> wrote:<br /><strong>JimBeam</strong> wrote:<br /><p>The point I'm trying to make is if we let a guy out of prison because we find other DNA or lack of his DNA at a crime scene how do we know he just didnt leave any ?</p><p><font size="3">I've never heard of a guy being released because they didn't find any DNA.&nbsp; It's usually they have DNA from one person, the victim says only one person raped her, and the DNA is not from the person accused or convicted.&nbsp;&nbsp; If there is only one person, and the DNA from the one rapist doesn't match, that pretty much rules out the accused.</font></p><p>Outside of the kid coming out Chinese I'm not sure how her being pregnant helps the defense.</p><p>Even if she got knocked up the next day that doesnt mean she couldnt have still been raped.</p><p><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="3">It helps the defense because people may see the fact that she was&nbsp;willing to have sex two weeks after the alleged incident as evidence that she wasn't raped.&nbsp;&nbsp;Rape is a traumatic event, and it often inhibits the person for a long time from voluntarily having sex, because the act reminds the victim of being raped.&nbsp;&nbsp; Gang rape is even worse.&nbsp; </font></p><p>i think i heard them say that they wanted to do a paternity test to see if any of the players were the father</p><p>and its&nbsp;still possible that the test was wrong but still got preggers from the alledged rape</p>

[Brujo]

This case smells of a setup.

[JimBeam]

<p>Apparently more story changes :</p><p><a href="http://www.newsobserver.com/1185/story/531253.html" target="_blank">http://www.newsobserver.com/1185/story/531253.html</a></p>

[Snacks]

<p>they should just drop all charges. This is getting stupid. A mans biggest fear is being charged with rape or sexual assault without it being true. and these poor guys are going through it right now. It sucks that all a women has to say is &quot;I was raped&quot; or assaulted etc and even if its not true the guys life will be ruined forever. These guys names have been drug through the mud and this women has had her name kept from the public to protect her.</p><p>Well maybe a new law should be passed.&nbsp;no ones name should be released victim or accused. </p><p>At the end of the day when someone is arrested for this type of crime, even if not convicted or the truth comes out, they have that over their head for life and not everyone will believe they are innocent even when they are.</p><p>P.S </p><p>The DA should be fired, sued and charged with something and lose his law license. The accuser should be arrested and sued for making a false claim and ruining these guys lives.</p>

[JimBeam]

<p>What actually sucks is if these guys did do something inapprproate and then either she, her people or the DA got the idea to try and make it bigger.</p><p>Now they'll get nothing.</p><p>The DA is already facing disbarrmnet over a whole bunch of things he's done wrong.</p><p>And what was that blurb about the DA and lab agreeing not to share evidence</p><p>WTF ??</p>

[Snacks]

<strong>JimBeam</strong> wrote:<br /><p>What actually sucks is if these guys did do something <font style="background-color: #ffff00">inapprproate</font> and then either she, her people or the DA got the idea to try and make it bigger.</p><p>Now they'll get nothing.</p><p>The DA is already facing disbarrmnet over a whole bunch of things he's done wrong.</p><p>And what was that blurb about the DA and lab agreeing not to share evidence</p><p>WTF ??</p><p>inapprproate doesnt me illegal. I agree they may be dicks but its not illegal to be a dick or do something inapprproate.</p>

[TokeOne]

As a criminal defense attorney I hate this case from both sides. I hate the fact that the DA is railroading these guys, who are probably innocent of rape and kidnapping but guilty of being assholes, with flimsy evidence, but at the same time I hate the fact that I carry about 10 cases or so that are more poorly prosecuted that this case, that have less evidence than this case, guys that are held with no bond or million dollar bond that they can't post and where is the scruntiny? Where is Bill O'Reilly to champion these guys' cause? All these tough on crime guys like O'Reilly turn into bleeding hearts on this case. And in the end, my guys lose their job, their family, and these two Duke guys are invited back to school. Screw 'em all.

[Snacks]

<strong>TokeOne</strong> wrote:<br />As a criminal defense attorney I hate this case from both sides. I hate the fact that the DA is railroading these guys, who are probably innocent of rape and kidnapping but guilty of being assholes, with flimsy evidence, but at the same time I hate the fact that I carry about 10 cases or so that are more poorly prosecuted that this case, that have less evidence than this case, guys that are held with no bond or million dollar bond that they can't post and where is the scruntiny? Where is Bill O'Reilly to champion these guys' cause? All these tough on crime guys like O'Reilly turn into bleeding hearts on this case. And in the end, my guys lose their job, their family, and these two Duke guys are invited back to school. Screw 'em all. <p>good post, I agree with you. Oreilly is so that guy your talking about. </p><p>That my point about keeping the acused name and face out of the public until the case is completed. We dont want victims to be affraid to come forward, but we also shouldnt want peoples lives ruined because a false acusation.</p>

[ralphbxny]

All I needed to know about this case Rev. Al showed me. He said it was a bad thing and all this shit and flew down there...and never made one appearance with the chick. He was on the first plane back and said nothing else about the case.

[JimBeam]

<p>New story.</p><p>What I don't get is the lady is saying that &quot; we should wait until the judge makes a decision ... &quot; so why should the students be punished prior to that ?</p><p>Shouldnt they be allowed to go to school until wrong doing has been proved ?</p><p>That's what is baffling me about this case from the start.</p><p><a href="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070112/ap_on_re_us/duke_lacrosse" target="_blank">http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070112/ap_on_re_us/duke_lacrosse</a></p>

<span class=post_edited>This message was edited by JimBeam on 1-12-07 @ 3:23 PM</span>

[sailor]

<font size="2">the <a href="http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=2729426" target="_blank" title="d.a.">prosecutor</a> just asked to be removed from the case. </font>

[sailor]

the duke president apologized (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=3042067) today for not supporting the lacrosse team.

[Zorro]

the duke president apologized (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=3042067) today for not supporting the lacrosse team.

I wonder how much Duke saved in the lawsuit settlement by the School President making that statement