Monday Night RAW Discussion

[cougarjake13]

He is the most successful ex-spirit squad member, right?




well yeh


but also hes the only other one who got a decent shot after spirit squad

other being kenny dykstra

[TripleSkeet]

Am I the only one that liked the Spirit Squad and thought they were a great stable???

I dont know why, I just dug how they would actually use their gimmick, like bringing out trampolines and shit to do some awesome moves.

[Sue_Bender]

Am I the only one that liked the Spirit Squad and thought they were a great stable???


Yup. I hope so.

[brettmojo]

Am I the only one that liked the Spirit Squad and thought they were a great stable???
http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/4224/jaysn9.gif

[TripleSkeet]

Man, fuck you guys lol. I remember having front row seats to Raw and me and 3 other guys came dressed as them with the green adidas pants and under armour shirts with headbands and wristbands. Laugh all you want but it got me a hug from Lillian Garcia! :wub:

[TripleSkeet]

One other thing, did anyone notice the 2-21-11 thing they were advertising with the guy in the long black coat? I just assumed it was the Undertaker returning for his usual Wrestlemania match. But now on the wrestling web sites they are saying there is a strong chance its a vignette for Sting to finally come to the WWE and take on the Undertaker at Mania for his first match.

The whole reason being they dont have a big match to sell the wrestling fringe fans on this year (ex. Streak vs. Career, Show vs Mayweather, McMahon vs Trump etc.)

I have no idea how true or close they are to pulling this off but if they do I for one will be shocked and happy as all hell. I would love to see this happen. I do know Sting is not under contract to TNA anymore and like Booker T and Nash have been in talks with the WWE. This would be amazing.

[cougarjake13]

i missed that

ill have to check dvr

[Bob Impact]

One other thing, did anyone notice the 2-21-11 thing they were advertising with the guy in the long black coat? I just assumed it was the Undertaker returning for his usual Wrestlemania match. But now on the wrestling web sites they are saying there is a strong chance its a vignette for Sting to finally come to the WWE and take on the Undertaker at Mania for his first match.

The whole reason being they dont have a big match to sell the wrestling fringe fans on this year (ex. Streak vs. Career, Show vs Mayweather, McMahon vs Trump etc.)

I have no idea how true or close they are to pulling this off but if they do I for one will be shocked and happy as all hell. I would love to see this happen. I do know Sting is not under contract to TNA anymore and like Booker T and Nash have been in talks with the WWE. This would be amazing.

According to the Daily News he already signed but literally nobody else has confirmed that.

[epo]

Did Orton break Punk's nose?

[Kevin]

Did Orton break Punk's nose?

GREEN BAY WISCONSIN!!

WHATS UP!

[epo]

GREEN BAY WISCONSIN!!

WHATS UP!

That was funny that the crowd jumped on his dumbass for that.

[Kevin]

That was funny that the crowd jumped on his dumbass for that.

Cole had to ruin it with his over the top awfulness though.

Christ is he terrible.

[cougarjake13]

Cole had to ruin it with his over the top awfulness though.

Christ is he terrible.

hes starting o piss me off

mostly i can ignore but now its unbearable

[CYYYFYYY]

Cole makes the show about him which an announcer should never do.

[cougarjake13]

Cole makes the show about him which an announcer should never do.

yeh but we dont know if hes being told to do that or not

[Chimee]

yeh but we dont know if hes being told to do that or not

I think it's a mixture. I doubt he was told to start jumping up and down to get the fans to mock R-Truth when the match was supposed to end with a serious beatdown and injury angle.

[cougarjake13]

I think it's a mixture. I doubt he was told to start jumping up and down to get the fans to mock R-Truth when the match was supposed to end with a serious beatdown and injury angle.



no now i think he has cart blanche to do whatever he can to be heelish

[Dirtbag]

I think it's a mixture. I doubt he was told to start jumping up and down to get the fans to mock R-Truth when the match was supposed to end with a serious beatdown and injury angle.

Yeah. Even if he wasn't told to behave like an ass, he could have been told to sit the fuck down and wasn't.

[TripleSkeet]

So who do you think the Wrestlemania guest host is? I have a weird feeling its The Rock.

[Chimee]

So who do you think the Wrestlemania guest host is? I have a weird feeling its The Rock.

Anyone else would be a great disappointment.

[cougarjake13]

So who do you think the Wrestlemania guest host is? I have a weird feeling its The Rock.

was my first thought

[johnniehardrock]

So who do you think the Wrestlemania guest host is? I have a weird feeling its The Rock.

You are correct sir

[Space Edge]

Good stuff :clap::clap:

[NickyL0885]

7 years later and the man still has it. AWESOME!

[Space Edge]

they are even going late on USA carrying this. Can't wait for him to beat the shit out of Cena.

[TripleSkeet]

FINALLY.

That was the most entertaining promo to hit Raw in 5 years at least. He fucking owned Miz, Cena and Michael Cole like he hasnt missed a beat.:clap:

[conman823]

FINALLY.

That was the most entertaining promo to hit Raw in 5 years at least. He fucking owned Miz, Cena and Michael Cole like he hasnt missed a beat.:clap:

What did he's not leaving mean? Is his deal long term? I assumed it would be a non-wrestling "host" role for one night.

And i agree the most entertainment in years on that show.

[TripleSkeet]

What did he's not leaving mean? Is his deal long term? I assumed it would be a non-wrestling "host" role for one night.

And i agree the most entertainment in years on that show.

I dont know, that kind of took me by surprise. Who knows? They did just announce that next years Wrestlemania will be in Miami. Maybe a HOF induction?

[Kevin]

I knew i missed the man but did not know how much til tonight.

He is the best ever.

These weeks heading into WM will be awesome.

With the Rumors of Stink Vs UT, it could be even better.

And what the hell happened to Nash, will he start his stuff after the PPV?

[Tenbatsuzen]

I'm still laughing over the fruity pebbles line.

[Fallon]

FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Holy shit was that awesome. I have a feeling he might ref the Cena/Miz match, but I'd much rather see him take on Cena at Mania.

He said he was sticking around, I'd love for him to do one more run till Miami.

Didn't realize how long he was gone and forgot how awesome he is.

[conman823]

And I'm sure no daytime soap writers in the back handed him his script before he went out there.

I didn't think I had any "Mark out" moments left until last night

[TripleSkeet]

And I'm sure no daytime soap writers in the back handed him his script before he went out there.

I didn't think I had any "Mark out" moments left until last night

Of course not. Just goes to show the difference between a scripted promo and a promo the wrestler actually has to come up with on his own. Also theres no way they wouldve left the asses, bitch, and damns in there. lol

I marked out so huge last night. When he told Michael Cole "if he took one more step hed smack the taste out of his mouth so hard hed never get it back" I was loving it.

The best though was when he said Cena looked like he fell out of Barneys anus.

[brettmojo]

I'm so mad I missed this.

[TripleSkeet]

I'm so mad I missed this.

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<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/mZuNCeLF2lc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[brettmojo]

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[foodcourtdruide]

Awesome! I know what I'll be watching next Monday night at 9pm.

[asayresk]

They Should bring back the coach so the rock could rip on his candy ass. All jokes aside i cant believe i missed this live. The Rock Summed it up perfectly, the wwe has gone from the dominated attitude era to the chucky cheese show.

[Tenbatsuzen]

They Should bring back the coach so the rock could rip on his candy ass. All jokes aside i cant believe i missed this live.

Coach is working for ESPN. No way he comes back.

Kevin Kelly, on the other hand...

[Kevin]

The best thing about the Beiber joke is that he and Cena basically have the same fans.


Kids, young girls and Fallon.

So he would have worked!

[Fallon]

The best thing about the Beiber joke is that he and Cena basically have the same fans.


Kids, young girls and Fallon.

So he would have worked!

Just because I dressed up like a fruity pebble for Halloween doesn't mean I like Cena!

http://i53.tinypic.com/2ylo3fb.jpg

[TripleSkeet]

Just because I dressed up like a fruity pebble for Halloween doesn't mean I like Cena!

http://i53.tinypic.com/2ylo3fb.jpg

Thats actually a pretty well done costume. All you were missing was the muscles.

[cougarjake13]

I knew i missed the man but did not know how much til tonight.

He is the best ever.

These weeks heading into WM will be awesome.

With the Rumors of Stink Vs UT,




it looked like hbk in that video to me

[Dirtbag]

Latest rumors are that HHH is ready to retire and we'll get another streak vs. career at WM.

[cougarjake13]

Latest rumors are that HHH is ready to retire and we'll get another streak vs. career at WM.

gay

[King Imp]

With the Rumors of Stink Vs UT, it could be even better.

I don't watch anymore, but I still go to the site every week to see what's going on.
Who is Stink?

[TripleSkeet]

I don't watch anymore, but I still go to the site every week to see what's going on.
Who is Stink?

He meant to say Sting.

[Fallon]

He meant to say Sting.

Or Stinknuts.

[ScottFromGA]

Just because I dressed up like a fruity pebble for Halloween doesn't mean I like Cena!

http://i53.tinypic.com/2ylo3fb.jpg

whose the 15 year old?

[styckx]

Rocks return, insane pop, crown control (and participation) and promo was a sad reminder how no one.. Not even Flair, HBK, HHH, Jericho or Cena have ever come remotely close to breathing the same air as that man since he left.

[Space Edge]

The return of The Undertaker and Tripple H tonight.

[Fallon]

The return of The Undertaker and Tripple H tonight.

Booker T, Rock, Trish, Taker, HHH, Christian.

Lots of cool shit going on!

[TripleSkeet]

- That Cena promo on The Rock tonight showed me 2 things...
1. If they would give him back his rap gimmick he would be great again. That was a really good promo. There is HUGE money to be made with these 2 and I really hope The Rock winds up coming back to wrestle for awhile for this. The crowd was already turning on Cena as there were a ton of signs against him and for The Rock.

2. The WWE is slowly getting back its edge and loosening up the whole PG thing. Thank fucking God.

- Taker and HHH both come back at the same time. Nice way to hype mania. Looks like they are going for the revenge angle, maybe another streak vs. career match. Wouldve loved to see Sting. Maybe someday.

- Hacksaw Jim Duggan in the HOF? Really? The guy was a fucking jobber. Oh well hopefully the rumors of Abdullah the Butcher and The Road Warriors going in this year are true.

- The WWE had a huge oppurtunity to make the tag team championships interesting again and blew it terribly. Letting Cena and the Miz win them was a great idea. They also shouldve kept them after Mania. The big Mania tag match couldve been for the Number 1 contenders spot.

- I get the whole "get Michael Cole as much cheap heat as we can" gimmick they are going for, but to have him come in and say he was better then Gordon Solie, JR and Gorilla Monsoon is just ridiculous silly. Theyve gone so overboard with this. They should just have a quick squash match with the King and have him go back to being a normal announcer. Unfortunately I have a feeling they are going to let him win somehow and beat this dead horse even more.

[brettmojo]

- That Cena promo on The Rock tonight showed me 2 things...
1. If they would give him back his rap gimmick he would be great again. That was a really good promo. There is HUGE money to be made with these 2 and I really hope The Rock winds up coming back to wrestle for awhile for this. The crowd was already turning on Cena as there were a ton of signs against him and for The Rock.
THis.

Cena was the best when he was a punk. His whole run with his Fruit Pebbles gimmick WHICH IS THE PERFECT THING TO CALL IT has been awful. Asshole heel Cena vs. The People's Champ and they could have the feud of the summer. Please let this be the beginning of turning Cena heel FINALLY.

[TripleSkeet]

THis.

Cena was the best when he was a punk. His whole run with his Fruit Pebbles gimmick WHICH IS THE PERFECT THING TO CALL IT has been awful. Asshole heel Cena vs. The People's Champ and they could have the feud of the summer. Please let this be the beginning of turning Cena heel FINALLY.

Ya know supposedly the whole reason Vince doesnt want to turn him heel is because he didnt want to hurt merchandise sales. Well if theres one guy that could get the ENTIRE crowd to turn on Cena and make up for the merch sales with ones of his own, its The Rock.

[cougarjake13]

Ya know supposedly the whole reason Vince doesnt want to turn him heel is because he didnt want to hurt merchandise sales. Well if theres one guy that could get the ENTIRE crowd to turn on Cena and make up for the merch sales with ones of his own, its The Rock.

plus if they do it right they'll still have the young kids loving cena while most men hate him even if he goes heel

[cougarjake13]

Booker T, Rock, Trish, Taker, HHH, Christian.

Lots of cool shit going on!

when did trish come back ? the ppv?

[TripleSkeet]

when did trish come back ? the ppv?

Yea.

Her, Booker T., Stone Cold and Hugh Morris are gonna be the trainers on Tough Enough.

[conman823]

Hacksaw deserves it, yeah he was never a main eventer but he was always getting the crowds going and the kids loved him. I for one am proud to see him honored.

Road Warriors would be great also.

[MIKEYDAKEN]

Hacksaw deserves it, yeah he was never a main eventer but he was always getting the crowds going and the kids loved him. I for one am proud to see him honored.

Road Warriors would be great also.

if you think about it hacksaw was the 80's cena.

[brettmojo]

when did trish come back ? the ppv?

Yea.

Her, Booker T., Stone Cold and Hugh Morris are gonna be the trainers on Tough Enough.
Ehhhhh... I don't know, still might not be enough to get me to watch that thing.

Put Trish vs. Eve in a gravy bowl match and we'll talk.

[Fallon]

I don't get Eve. She might be my least favorite diva looks wise in WWE (excluding Vickie).

[brettmojo]

I don't get Eve. She might be my least favorite diva looks wise in WWE (excluding Vickie).
Meh. Works for me.

I would have said Maryse but blond on blond is boring.

[NickyL0885]

Meh. Works for me.

I would have said Maryse but blond on blond is boring.

I just want to see HLA.

[asayresk]

They should just call Michael McGillicutty Joe Henning.

[TripleSkeet]

This is what a promo from the heart looks like. Incase anyone has forgotten because we havent seen one in 5 years...
<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/dNAbYN5S29Y" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[NickyL0885]

This is what a promo from the heart looks like. Incase anyone has forgotten because we havent seen one in 5 years...
<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/dNAbYN5S29Y" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I lost it when he called Cena a "yaba daba bitch!"

[Dirtbag]

The whole "Finally the Rock has come back..." schtick only works when, y'know, he actually comes back. I'm hoping the crowd's lack of response to him trying to get them to play sing-a-long either makes him actually show up live more often, or at least gets him to stop taping promos as if they're live.

[RingWraith]

The whole "Finally the Rock has come back..." schtick only works when, y'know, he actually comes back. I'm hoping the crowd's lack of response to him trying to get them to play sing-a-long either makes him actually show up live more often, or at least gets him to stop taping promos as if they're live.

Agreed. I'm pretty sure that crowd was disappointed that The Rock wasn't there Live in-person.

[NickyL0885]

Agreed. I'm pretty sure that crowd was disappointed that The Rock wasn't there Live in-person.

Yea. He was getting killed on twitter. Even anti-Cena fans were all "i hate Cena but at least he shows up each week"

[Chimee]

I think he'll make another live appearance before Wrestlemania. Or they'll go with the stupid thing of having his music play during a Cena match and then playing another video.

[cougarjake13]

sadly he has no reason to show up each week

[conman823]

sadly he has no reason to show up each week

He does if he wants any respect from the fans.
I hate Cena with a passion but he has the high ground just by saying you never show up.
It was like how HBK came out and said Hogan will be back when the fans give him what he wants. Then rubbed his fingers with the money sign.
Also this war of words is taking away from, um gee, oh yeah the fact that Cena is fighting The Miz.

[RingWraith]

Apparently the WM17 match between HHH and Undertaker never happened! :dry:

F4WOnline.com is reporting that the WWE creative team has been told not to mention or have either Triple H or The Undertaker reference their match at WrestleMania 17.

As most are aware, 'Taker and Triple H wrestled each other 10 years ago at WrestleMania, and of course The Undertaker won. But WWE wants to put Triple H over as a credible threat to The Undertaker's streak, so creative has been told not to have the bout mentioned on TV so that the marketability of the WrestleMania 27 match is not hurt, nor is the fan's perception that Triple H can actually end the streak.

[cougarjake13]

He does if he wants any respect from the fans.
I hate Cena with a passion but he has the high ground just by saying you never show up.
It was like how HBK came out and said Hogan will be back when the fans give him what he wants. Then rubbed his fingers with the money sign.
Also this war of words is taking away from, um gee, oh yeah the fact that Cena is fighting The Miz.

yeh i cant understand why theyr doing that


plus its supposed to be taker vs hhh but theyre bringing back the hhh-shaemus fued at same time, although now it looks like hes going into a fued with daniel bryan

[cougarjake13]

Apparently the WM17 match between HHH and Undertaker never happened! :dry:

and what we all knew was true is now confirmed



that they act like we're all goldfish and cant remember past a year back

[RingWraith]

and what we all knew was true is now confirmed



that they act like we're all goldfish and cant remember past a year back

Seriously, I hate it when they don't acknowledge their past feuds and/or match from years ago.

[Dirtbag]

Half of the current WWE fanbase wasn't even alive for WM17. Not that I agree with this decision, but I understand it.

[TripleSkeet]

They arent going to highlight the greatest Wrestlemania of all time so all their younger fans can look at it, compare it to the current product, and ask "WHAT THE FUCK HAPPENED???"

[RingWraith]

They arent going to highlight the greatest Wrestlemania of all time so all their younger fans can look at it, compare it to the current product, and ask "WHAT THE FUCK HAPPENED???"

HAHA!!!.. Probably.

[TripleSkeet]

For the record, Im probably the biggest Rock mark on this board, and even though I think John Cena is a good wrestler and overall very good performer I LOATHE his gimmick.

When he was just a rapper he was phenominal. Now that Vince has turned him into the 2nd coming of Hulk Hogan I hate it. Seriously. Hustle, Loyalty and Respect...and Never Give Up is 2011's version of Train, Say Your Prayers and Eat Your Vitamins. Its a lame and outdated gimmick. All that aside, it pains me to say that when he pulled this out on Monday night, I cracked up and had to give him his props...

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/3350/ibringitviasatellite.gif (http://img51.imageshack.us/i/ibringitviasatellite.gif/)

[Fallon]

plus its supposed to be taker vs hhh but theyre bringing back the hhh-shaemus fued at same time, although now it looks like hes going into a fued with daniel bryan

Six weeks or so between PPV's. Gotta fill the time without burning out the Mania hype. I actually like ,multi feuds, should lead to good tag matches.

[Fallon]

For the record, Im probably the biggest Rock mark on this board, and even though I think John Cena is a good wrestler and overall very good performer I LOATHE his gimmick.

When he was just a rapper he was phenominal. Now that Vince has turned him into the 2nd coming of Hulk Hogan I hate it. Seriously. Hustle, Loyalty and Respect...and Never Give Up is 2011's version of Train, Say Your Prayers and Eat Your Vitamins. Its a lame and outdated gimmick. All that aside, it pains me to say that when he pulled this out on Monday night, I cracked up and had to give him his props...

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/3350/ibringitviasatellite.gif (http://img51.imageshack.us/i/ibringitviasatellite.gif/)

I've been fast forwarding through Cena's promos for a few years now, but The Rock feud has brought what I used to like out of Cena back into the fold.

[cougarjake13]

Seriously, I hate it when they don't acknowledge their past feuds and/or match from years ago.

the worst is when its less than a year ago and they act like it didnt happen



which is why im shocked as shit that they referenced the orton-punk thing from a few years back

[cougarjake13]

For the record, Im probably the biggest Rock mark on this board, and even though I think John Cena is a good wrestler and overall very good performer I LOATHE his gimmick.

When he was just a rapper he was phenominal. Now that Vince has turned him into the 2nd coming of Hulk Hogan I hate it. Seriously. Hustle, Loyalty and Respect...and Never Give Up is 2011's version of Train, Say Your Prayers and Eat Your Vitamins. Its a lame and outdated gimmick. All that aside, it pains me to say that when he pulled this out on Monday night, I cracked up and had to give him his props...

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/3350/ibringitviasatellite.gif (http://img51.imageshack.us/i/ibringitviasatellite.gif/)

i did love that

but who even knows if it was his idea ... prolly wasnt

[cougarjake13]

Six weeks or so between PPV's. Gotta fill the time without burning out the Mania hype. I actually like ,multi feuds, should lead to good tag matches.

yeh but theyre not even doin anything with the mania matches

its all rock - cena with miz just on mon show attacking cena otherwise he was mia

[RingWraith]

the worst is when its less than a year ago and they act like it didnt happen



which is why im shocked as shit that they referenced the orton-punk thing from a few years back

Oh yeah, I too was very shocked that they brought that back as one of the reasons for the current feud. hah!

[Kevin]

They continue to try and make this jobber Miz look legit.

And they continue to FAIL.

That was the gayest beating ever given.

From his gimmick to his finisher.

WORST CHAMP EVER.

[TripleSkeet]

They continue to try and make this jobber Miz look legit.

And they continue to FAIL.

That was the gayest beating ever given.

From his gimmick to his finisher.

WORST CHAMP EVER.

I like him. Hes changed my opinion of him.

[NickyL0885]

They continue to try and make this jobber Miz look legit.

And they continue to FAIL.

That was the gayest beating ever given.

From his gimmick to his finisher.

WORST CHAMP EVER.

I disagree. I almost peed my self when he came out as The Rock.

[Fallon]

Miz was great tonight and they are doing great stuff with Cole/Lawler (minus the stupid box). Just wish it was between wrestlers and not announcers.

Miz and Snooki, MTV is taking over Mania!!

[RingWraith]

They continue to try and make this jobber Miz look legit.

And they continue to FAIL.

That was the gayest beating ever given.

From his gimmick to his finisher.

WORST CHAMP EVER.

I disagree! I think the Miz is a great heel champ.

[TripleSkeet]

The Rock destroyed Cena tonight too. I get that he cant be at Raw every week, and they use that in Cenas promos which have been really funny, but even I didnt expect The Rock to be that entertaining from a satellite feed. Hes got at least 1 more live appearance on Raw before mania and 1 the night after.

<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/s9VJ0swb1Ko" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[CYYYFYYY]

Miz gets incredible Heat. I know people will go insane but he reminds me of Piper. His finisher is top quality. They have to have him win a tad more often, like beating The Great Khalli

[Chimee]

I think The Miz was the best thing on RAW last night he had a great promo, beat down on Khali with a chair and got the better of John Cena again.

I will agree that he needs to win more. It doesn't help a champion if he's booked to lose against anyone above the middle of the card.

And, without Jericho around, he's probably the best heel in the company.

[StanUpshaw]

Wrestlemania-type question here:

Am I alone in thinking that the "kick out of each other's finishers a dozen times" style of WM main event kinda sucks? I watched those two HBK vs. Taker matches that were supposed to be 4.9995 stars, and each time they kicked out, I gave less and less of a shit (the very end of last years was awesome though).

[TjM]

2 things

Snooks might have found her calling I think she might have a fuure in wrestling

Ok I need to ask. IS ANYBODY! buying Del Rio for all the shit Cena and The Miz get at least I buy them as legit

[TjM]

Also am I the only one who sings "Vegatabe Garden Vegatable Garden dum-de-de-dum-dum-cornn" ala Al Bundy when Daniel Bryan comes to the ring

[StanUpshaw]

Ok I need to ask. IS ANYBODY! buying Del Rio for all the shit Cena and The Miz get at least I buy them as legit

HA!

Del Rio is the only shooter in the entire fucking company!

[TjM]

HA!

Del Rio is the only shooter in the entire fucking company!

FAN FUCKING TASTIC!!! quality in the 19-FUCKING-30's when one might shoot to take your title

Yet now it's 2011.


So again I ask

[StanUpshaw]

Then what the fuck do you mean by legit?

[TjM]

Then what the fuck do you mean by legit?

He may be tough but nothing about him speaks to me. I see him and I think MEH!

I mean total package. I mean a legit superstar

As a side not

Brian Cristopher seemed like he needed medical attention during that promo

[TjM]

I mean hell by all accounts Scott Norton was one tought SOB but no one ever made him #1 contender

[StanUpshaw]

I mean hell by all accounts Scott Norton was one tought SOB but no one ever made him #1 contender

And that's why wrestling sucks.

[TjM]

And that's why wrestling sucks.

Fuck no

Think about the "Attitude" days it would have been Shamrock and Blackman instead of Stone Cold and The Rock if you think about it

[StanUpshaw]

Fuck no

Think about the "Attitude" days it would have been Shamrock and Blackman instead of Stone Cold and The Rock if you think about it

That's why you have managers. Let them be on the mic and let the wrestlers be believable.


also, Steve Blackman lol

[StanUpshaw]

And honestly...can you remember a single Rock match ever? There were some memorable Stone Cold ones, but that had more to do with the fact that he was in there with Bret and Shawn.

[Bob Impact]

And honestly...can you remember a single Rock match ever? There were some memorable Stone Cold ones, but that had more to do with the fact that he was in there with Bret and Shawn.

Wrestlemania 19 and 17 with Austin, 88 with Hogan, No Mercy, Vengeance, and the Royal Rumble 01 - 02ish with Jericho, Triple threat with taker and angle at some ppv in 02.

[StanUpshaw]

Are you Meltzer?

[spe5150]

Anyone catch HBK not being able to read off a teleprompter & apparently no one in production noticing it?

"There's some kind of area about the streak that I think plays in the Undertaker's advantage..."

I can only assume he mis-read the word aura, but it totally distracted me from the rest of the promo. All I could think from that point on was, "Wow, even HBK has to regurgitate pre-written lines from their awful writers in today's WWE? Is nothing organic on that show anymore?"

[Bob Impact]

Are you Meltzer?

Pffft. Not a single one of those matches took place in Japan.

[Bob Impact]

Also vs Lesnar at SummerSlam 02

[foodcourtdruide]

Wrestlemania 19 and 17 with Austin, 88 with Hogan, No Mercy, Vengeance, and the Royal Rumble 01 - 02ish with Jericho, Triple threat with taker and angle at some ppv in 02.

I'm with Bob here, The Rock had so many amazing matches. Him and Austin basically were the draw of the attitude era, and both were very good on the mic and in the ring (Austin less so as he got older, but he still put on some great matches).

As time goes on, I think the attitude era was just a special moment in time that we'll probably never get back in wrestling. The two main attractions were so special, and the other main eventers (shawn michaels, mankind, shamrock, undertaker) were just so perfect for their roles. The booking especially was great, in my opinion what really killed the booking was the brand split. There just aren't enough top-tier guys, and what ended up happening was guys like Orton, Swagger, Sheamus get thrown into a very weak main event group and pushed way too early.

[StanUpshaw]

Don't get me wrong. That era was the only time I was an honest to goodness fan of wrestling. I still dip my toe in the pool every once in awhile, but I ate it up back then. Both of those guys were great, along with DX/HHH, Foley, Taker...everything! All the way down to Taka Michinoku cutting off Val Venis's cock.

But can you honestly say -- now that we're not caught up in the moment -- that the stuff they were doing is of much value now (besides nostalgia)? Can it stand up on its own? If I were to find a DVD from back then and try to analyze it objectively...would I say that the stars running down their laundry list of rote catch phrases is great (as I thought then), or would I say it's kinda lame and annoying? Actually...I probably wouldn't get that far because I'd be too busy watching whatever awesome midcard match starring Benoit, Angle or Jericho was on.

[asayresk]

I agree with you stan, wrestling is just embarassing now.

[TripleSkeet]

Don't get me wrong. That era was the only time I was an honest to goodness fan of wrestling. I still dip my toe in the pool every once in awhile, but I ate it up back then. Both of those guys were great, along with DX/HHH, Foley, Taker...everything! All the way down to Taka Michinoku cutting off Val Venis's cock.

But can you honestly say -- now that we're not caught up in the moment -- that the stuff they were doing is of much value now (besides nostalgia)? Can it stand up on its own? If I were to find a DVD from back then and try to analyze it objectively...would I say that the stars running down their laundry list of rote catch phrases is great (as I thought then), or would I say it's kinda lame and annoying? Actually...I probably wouldn't get that far because I'd be too busy watching whatever awesome midcard match starring Benoit, Angle or Jericho was on.

I watch the old Raws on WWE Classic and right now they are right at the start of the Attitude Era. Not one Raw in the past 5 years can even touch those shows. Not one.

The Rock had some of the most memorable matches of that era also. VS Austin at Mania 15 and 17. VS Hogan at 18, His I Quit match with Mankind. Survivor Series 98. The Nation vs DX. Even his feuds with Angle.

The Attitude Era is not rose colored glasses. Its the measuring stick of pro wrestling. Theres never been a better era before or since. Not just with the WWE, but with WCW going on (even though it was on its way down), and ECW at its peak. Not to say wrestling cant be that great again, it just hasnt happened.

[brettmojo]

I watch the old Raws on WWE Classic and right now they are right at the start of the Attitude Era. Not one Raw in the past 5 years can even touch those shows. Not one.

The Rock had some of the most memorable matches of that era also. VS Austin at Mania 15 and 17. VS Hogan at 18, His I Quit match with Mankind. Survivor Series 98. The Nation vs DX. Even his feuds with Angle.

The Attitude Era is not rose colored glasses. Its the measuring stick of pro wrestling. Theres never been a better era before or since. Not just with the WWE, but with WCW going on (even though it was on its way down), and ECW at its peak. Not to say wrestling cant be that great again, it just hasnt happened.
Wrestling can't be great again. Not with the pussification of America in full swing.

[TripleSkeet]

Wrestling can't be great again. Not with the pussification of America in full swing.

My only hope is that Vince McMahon eventually gets his own tv channel, and puts together a wrestling program for adult males, once again burying Monday Night Football and once again brings wrestling mainstream. Kind of like 1997, but without having to worry about cowtowing to faggot network executives.

[brettmojo]

My only hope is that Vince McMahon eventually gets his own tv channel, and puts together a wrestling program for adult males, once again burying Monday Night Football and once again brings wrestling mainstream. Kind of like 1997, but without having to worry about cowtowing to faggot network executives.
If we could get a MLB network... I guess there's hope.

[RingWraith]

Tonight's show was great IMO. Now I'm wondering which match will be last... HHH vs 'Taker or Cena vs Miz

[TripleSkeet]

Tonights Raw was really good. Im hoping that ending was the beginning of a Cena heel turn. He was getting booed out of the building from the minute his music hit.

Also, CM Punk should be headlining next years Wrestlemania.

[Fallon]

Tonights Raw was really good. Im hoping that ending was the beginning of a Cena heel turn. He was getting booed out of the building from the minute his music hit.

Heel Cena vs. Face Rock would be an amazing Mania next year, I'm hoping something can be put together.

[Tenbatsuzen]

Fallon -

Can you make a gif of Undertaker's reaction/grin/dismissal of HHH after Shawn left the ring during Raw last night?

[TjM]

Tonights Raw was really good. Im hoping that ending was the beginning of a Cena heel turn

Has to be done right.

[Fallon]

Fallon -

Can you make a gif of Undertaker's reaction/grin/dismissal of HHH after Shawn left the ring during Raw last night?


I will tonight.

[Tenbatsuzen]

Has to be done right.

Cena played the race card last night AND he did that "stare over a face's body after hitting your finisher" thing that emerging heels done.


I really, really hope WWE takes a page from the Ina Garten thing and have Cena blow off make a wish kids or something.

[Tenbatsuzen]

And honestly...can you remember a single Rock match ever? There were some memorable Stone Cold ones, but that had more to do with the fact that he was in there with Bret and Shawn.

Hogan/Rock, Wrestlemania 18, Toronto. One of the best and most bizarre matches I've ever seen in my entire life. It's the first time they ever changed the booking of a match and the ALIGNMENT OF ONE OF THE PARTICIPANTS ***DURING THE ACTUAL MATCH***.

[TjM]

Cena also left without slapping hands. That was out of character to say the least

[StanUpshaw]

I don't see it happening.

Heels don't sell merch.

[TjM]

As a complete aside

Trish is SOOOO much fucking hotter as a brunette

HOL COW!

[TjM]

Of course I hate blondes so that could color my opinion

[Tenbatsuzen]

As a complete aside

Trish is SOOOO much fucking hotter as a brunette

HOL COW!

THIS.

[Tenbatsuzen]

I don't see it happening.

Heels don't sell merch.

http://img.alibaba.com/wsphoto/v0/271278753/WWE_Austin_3_16_LONG_Sleeves_T_Shirt.jpg_200x200.j pg

[TjM]

Lets not forget that heel Rock. Never made a dime. Nor those bastereds Flair or Hogan

[StanUpshaw]

As a complete aside

Trish is SOOOO much fucking hotter as a brunette

HOL COW!

When Trish dressed up like Mickie that time...that was the hottest Trish ever looked.

[TjM]

They need to do a Jericho/Rey Misterio type turn

Still the best full heel turn I've seen

Jericho screaming to the crowd "DON'T YOU BOO ME!" "I'LL GIVE YOU A REASON TO BOO!!"

As he put Rey in the hospital

Could be done with Daniel Bryan in the Rey role

[StanUpshaw]

http://i.imgur.com/5xjBi.gif

[StanUpshaw]

Tonights Raw was really good. Im hoping that ending was the beginning of a Cena heel turn. He was getting booed out of the building from the minute his music hit.

That was happening way back during my last WWE phase (2006-7). Especially in smark towns like Chicago and Toronto. That part is nothing new.


But Cena's not turning heel any time soon. I mean he already is the heel in the Rock feud, but that means nothing because in a week, Rocky's gone and it's still going to be boy scout Cena versus chickenshit Miz.

The way it's been going, I predict Rock will be the one turning heel at Mania. It solidifies Cena as the sympathetic babyface getting fucked over and still needing revenge, plus it might even give Miz a much-needed rub by ending up with a megastar fighting at his side. It's the least Rock could do after he fucking buried them by fighting off a 2-on-1 beatdown.

[StanUpshaw]

Here's a question...

What is Randy Orton? I fast forward through nearly everything he does, so I haven't really grasped the nuances of his character. He got cold jumped with a wrench in front of his wife...so that indicates babyface, but then he always seems like the smug/pissy asshole he's always been. And then he has a move where he delivers a soccer kick to the head of a downed opponent. That's the most heelish move I've ever seen.


So what is Randy Orton, and more importantly, why does he suck so bad?

[Fallon]

Fallon -

Can you make a gif of Undertaker's reaction/grin/dismissal of HHH after Shawn left the ring during Raw last night?
http://www.gifsoup.com/view2/2244100/the-undertaker-o.gif

[StanUpshaw]

StanUpshaw's better

Now THAT is a fucking mod quote.

[conman823]

A minor peeve, why the hell did they change Jerry Lawlers music?

[TripleSkeet]

Lets not forget that heel Rock. Never made a dime. Nor those bastereds Flair or Hogan

DX and HHH too. Oh and the Undertaker when he was heel. Poor Vince. Having to depend on Taka Michinoku and Golddust to carry merchandise sales back then.

[TripleSkeet]

That was happening way back during my last WWE phase (2006-7). Especially in smark towns like Chicago and Toronto. That part is nothing new.


But Cena's not turning heel any time soon. I mean he already is the heel in the Rock feud, but that means nothing because in a week, Rocky's gone and it's still going to be boy scout Cena versus chickenshit Miz.

The way it's been going, I predict Rock will be the one turning heel at Mania. It solidifies Cena as the sympathetic babyface getting fucked over and still needing revenge, plus it might even give Miz a much-needed rub by ending up with a megastar fighting at his side. It's the least Rock could do after he fucking buried them by fighting off a 2-on-1 beatdown.

Rumor going around is The Rock could be around til Summerslam. Hes already scheduled for Raw the night after Mania. Youre not going to get people to turn on The Rock. Youve got a better chance of the kids turning on Cena in favor of Rocky. I just hope he sticks around.

I just hope he sticks around. The only time in the last year Raw ratings have gone over 4 is the 2 times The Rock was there live.

[Fallon]

A minor peeve, why the hell did they change Jerry Lawlers music?



I know right! His new music is lame.

[StanUpshaw]

DX and HHH too. Oh and the Undertaker when he was heel. Poor Vince. Having to depend on Taka Michinoku and Golddust to carry merchandise sales back then.

All of the people you guys are mentioning were not heels in any true sense of the word. They were assholes and anti-heroes, but they were all the people you were supposed to cheer for. But that era of wrestling is over (well, I guess you could watch TNA). Wrestling is aimed at the kids right now, and there's no chance they're going to ruin the one established babyface in the entire company for some Russo-esque heel turn that makes no sense for business or storyline.

[TripleSkeet]

All of the people you guys are mentioning were not heels in any true sense of the word. They were assholes and anti-heroes, but they were all the people you were supposed to cheer for. But that era of wrestling is over (well, I guess you could watch TNA). Wrestling is aimed at the kids right now, and there's no chance they're going to ruin the one established babyface in the entire company for some Russo-esque heel turn that makes no sense for business or storyline.

It makes sense because he gets booed ALOT. Not all kids love the guy. If you read any wrestling biographies they all say the same thing about heels and faces. The crowd determines whos a heel and who isnt. This isnt like when they turned Stone Cold at Mania 17. This is a guy thats already getting plenty of boos. Like when they turned The Rock or Bret Hart in the mid 90s.

He would make a great heel, he already has. And he would still sell plenty of merchandise.

[brettmojo]

As a complete aside

Trish is SOOOO much fucking hotter as a brunette

HOL COW!
http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/7011/singaporecanezr7.gif

Rumor going around is The Rock could be around til Summerslam. Hes already scheduled for Raw the night after Mania. Youre not going to get people to turn on The Rock. Youve got a better chance of the kids turning on Cena in favor of Rocky. I just hope he sticks around.

I just hope he sticks around. The only time in the last year Raw ratings have gone over 4 is the 2 times The Rock was there live.
I'd hate to say it, but Cena really made the Rock look bad on Raw. Cena pretty much shut down Rocky. It was very un-Cena like, very unexpected and is probably the best promo he's ever cut. .. And then all the Rock came back with was,"OH I'MMA GONNA' WHOOP YOUR MONKEY ASS!" Uncharacteristically weak. Maybe I was a little jaded by he fact that Rock hasn't shown up for the past six weeks or however long it's been since he said he supposedly was "never leaving again" but he came off as the loser in that confrontation Monday night.

And I'm not even counting the Miz in that because the Miz just sucked complete shit. Out there next to Cena and Rock he looked like a lost mentally challenged child. What the fuck was with his sidekick being there? Wasn't he fired like a month ago?

[conman823]

http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/7011/singaporecanezr7.gif


I'd hate to say it, but Cena really made the Rock look bad on Raw. Cena pretty much shut down Rocky. It was very un-Cena like, very unexpected and is probably the best promo he's ever cut. .. And then all the Rock came back with was,"OH I'MMA GONNA' WHOOP YOUR MONKEY ASS!" Uncharacteristically weak. Maybe I was a little jaded by he fact that Rock hasn't shown up for the past six weeks or however long it's been since he said he supposedly was "never leaving again" but he came off as the loser in that confrontation Monday night.

And I'm not even counting the Miz in that because the Miz just sucked complete shit. Out there next to Cena and Rock he looked like a lost mentally challenged child. What the fuck was with his sidekick being there? Wasn't he fired like a month ago?

This is exactly what happened.

And they ruined Jerry Lawler's music.

And CM Punk > Randal Orton

[TripleSkeet]

I'd hate to say it, but Cena really made the Rock look bad on Raw. Cena pretty much shut down Rocky. It was very un-Cena like, very unexpected and is probably the best promo he's ever cut. .. And then all the Rock came back with was,"OH I'MMA GONNA' WHOOP YOUR MONKEY ASS!" Uncharacteristically weak. Maybe I was a little jaded by he fact that Rock hasn't shown up for the past six weeks or however long it's been since he said he supposedly was "never leaving again" but he came off as the loser in that confrontation Monday night.


Ill agree with that. The bottom line is unless The Rock plans to come back and wrestle full time Cena will always have that card to pull on him. And as good as a promo as it was, it was one of the very few that hes ever cut that wasnt a rap and didnt completely suck.

Even in the beginning when he was playing the whole suck up part, theres a way to do that without coming off as a pussy, and that wasnt it. His babyface promos blow and they blatantly try and pander to the crowd, thats why he was always a better heel.

[Tenbatsuzen]

http://www.gifsoup.com/view2/2244100/the-undertaker-o.gif

thanks to fallon and stanupshaw for these.

[brettmojo]

People don't understand that's exactly why Cena sucks. You can't try to be 80's Hulk Hogan. It's 2011. That shit doesn't fly anymore. Since the Attitude Era that shit is completely lame and dated. Rock was right about Cena, you can't act like Barney The Dinosaur fucking Fruity Pebbles and expect the actual wrestling crowd to take you seriously. You can't just win a fucking match after being beaten to death for twenty-five minutes after hitting the same three fucking moves that you win every match with. He's a two dimensional fucking cartoon character with a non-existent move set.

It's not "internent smarks" running a grand conspiracy against the guy. It's fans not willing to just cheer whoever the WWE tells them to cheer for.

[Tenbatsuzen]

People don't understand that's exactly why Cena sucks. You can't try to be 80's Hulk Hogan. It's 2011. That shit doesn't fly anymore. Since the Attitude Era that shit is completely lame and dated. Rock was right about Cena, you can't act like Barney The Dinosaur fucking Fruity Pebbles and expect the actual wrestling crowd to take you seriously. You can't just win a fucking match after being beaten to death for twenty-five minutes after hitting the same three fucking moves that you win every match with. He's a two dimensional fucking cartoon character with a non-existent move set.

It's not "internent smarks" running a grand conspiracy against the guy. It's fans not willing to just cheer whoever the WWE tells them to cheer for.

But whatever Cena is doing, he moves merch. That is tangible evidence that something is going right with this.

So it's basically one of two things - appeal to the kids and women and move merch, or appeal to the "actual wrestling fans crowd" - who may not buy as much merch.

[brettmojo]

But whatever Cena is doing, he moves merch. That is tangible evidence that something is going right with this.

So it's basically one of two things - appeal to the kids and women and move merch, or appeal to the "actual wrestling fans crowd" - who may not buy as much merch.
To have a guy be the face of your company because women like to buy his t-shirts to make their boyfriends jealous and so that kids have something to wear when they're playing so they don't mess their good clothes is really lame.

[conman823]

I like John Cena, the guy. He does a shit load of charity work, seems really down to earth, and really gives off the vibe of a big fan who made it big in his dream career. He isn't a junky loser like Hardy or an over inflated ego case like Bret Hart, as far as kids role models go, you can do a hell of a lot worse these days.

That being said

I hate John Cena, the "sports entertainer". His character is the embodiment of everything wrong with the "WWE Universe". Crap move set. Superman like powers in an already fake world. Company line tower to the Nth degree.

[StanUpshaw]

To have a guy be the face of your company because women like to buy his t-shirts to make their boyfriends jealous and so that kids have something to wear when they're playing so they don't mess their good clothes is really lame.

Stop watching WWE for fuck's sake. It's obviously not for you.

[brettmojo]

Stop watching WWE for fuck's sake. It's obviously not for you.
I haven't watched it. I started watching when Rock showed up six weeks ago. Before that I hadn't watched a majority of a Raw for well over three years.

Minus the Miz, Vicki, Cole and Cena Raw wouldn't be so bad.

AND BESIDES, Trish is back! Of course I'm gonna' watch.

[cougarjake13]

Here's a question...

What is Randy Orton? I fast forward through nearly everything he does, so I haven't really grasped the nuances of his character. He got cold jumped with a wrench in front of his wife...so that indicates babyface, but then he always seems like the smug/pissy asshole he's always been. And then he has a move where he delivers a soccer kick to the head of a downed opponent. That's the most heelish move I've ever seen.


So what is Randy Orton, and more importantly, why does he suck so bad?




hes a hybrid heel-face and theyre basically trying to make him the 2011 version of stone cold


even going so far as making note of the similarities ... stone cold the rattlesnake ... orton the viper

trying to be a heel but has some face tendencies ... at least he has since they ended legacy

[StanUpshaw]

Cool.


Another question: Are the people who heap hyperbolic praise on The Rock and hold him up as a model of wrestling perfection...then in the very next sentence criticize John Cena's paltry "moveset"....doing so intentionally for clever ironic effect?

[Dirtbag]

Cool.


Another question: Are the people who heap hyperbolic praise on The Rock and hold him up as a model of wrestling perfection...then in the very next sentence criticize John Cena's paltry "moveset"....doing so intentionally for clever ironic effect?

Come on. I was one of the people trashing Rock & Austin for their movesets while marking out over Benoit, Malenko, etc, but even they had more than Cena ever did. And like many other things, its not even Cena's fault. His match with RVD at ONS2 was decent because it wasn't the typical Cena match. The guy, for better or for worse, is the poster boy for going out and doing exactly what he's told.

[Chimee]

Come on. I was one of the people trashing Rock & Austin for their movesets while marking out over Benoit, Malenko, etc, but even they had more than Cena ever did. And like many other things, its not even Cena's fault. His match with RVD at ONS2 was decent because it wasn't the typical Cena match. The guy, for better or for worse, is the poster boy for going out and doing exactly what he's told.

I think it's one of those things where the children want to see Super Cena do the Hulk Hogan match where he gets beaten on, overcomes the odds, hits his signature spots and wins. Difference between Cena and Hogan is, when it is needed, Cena can actually work a decent match. He had the 50 minute one with HBK a few years back and I'm sure there have been some others that have been outside the Cena mold.

[TjM]

I think it's one of those things where the children want to see Super Cena do the Hulk Hogan match where he gets beaten on, overcomes the odds, hits his signature spots and wins. Difference between Cena and Hogan is, when it is needed, Cena can actually work a decent match. He had the 50 minute one with HBK a few years back and I'm sure there have been some others that have been outside the Cena mold.

His matches with Edge were solid

[brettmojo]

Cool.


Another question: Are the people who heap hyperbolic praise on The Rock and hold him up as a model of wrestling perfection...then in the very next sentence criticize John Cena's paltry "moveset"....doing so intentionally for clever ironic effect?

Come on. I was one of the people trashing Rock & Austin for their movesets while marking out over Benoit, Malenko, etc, but even they had more than Cena ever did. And like many other things, its not even Cena's fault. His match with RVD at ONS2 was decent because it wasn't the typical Cena match. The guy, for better or for worse, is the poster boy for going out and doing exactly what he's told.
This.

[cougarjake13]

Cool.


Another question: Are the people who heap hyperbolic praise on The Rock and hold him up as a model of wrestling perfection...then in the very next sentence criticize John Cena's paltry "moveset"....doing so intentionally for clever ironic effect?

seriously ... you really think cena fans are that smart ?

[StanUpshaw]

So do we still think we're seeing a Cena heel turn any day now?

[Tenbatsuzen]

So do we still think we're seeing a Cena heel turn any day now?

BTW, Miz's t-shirts sold out at Raw on Monday.

[StanUpshaw]

Show me the numbers!

[TripleSkeet]

BTW, Miz's t-shirts sold out at Raw on Monday.

Impossible. Nobody buys heel merch. Remember how shitty those nWo shirts did? People want slogans like Never Give Up!

[StanUpshaw]

Clearly they do! Or are you saying that Cena actually doesn't sell, and all those rainbow colored children are just plants?

[TripleSkeet]

Clearly they do! Or are you saying that Cena actually doesn't sell, and all those rainbow colored children are just plants?

My point is entertaining wrestlers sell merchandise. It has nothing to do with good guy, bad guy. Some of the highest sellers of all times were heels. That whole notion that you have to be a good guy to move merchandise is complete horse shit.

[StanUpshaw]

Again, you seem to have a fundamental misunderstanding of booking and psychology. You aren't a heel if you're the one the crowd is supposed to cheer for.

[Tenbatsuzen]

Again, you seem to have a fundamental misunderstanding of booking and psychology. You aren't a heel if you're the one the crowd is supposed to cheer for.

You're changing the argument from "cheering" to "moving merchandise". Your whole point was Cena wouldn't go heel because of the merch. Miz moves merch.

[StanUpshaw]

You're changing the argument from "cheering" to "moving merchandise". Your whole point was Cena wouldn't go heel because of the merch. Miz moves merch.

People keep bringing up shit like NWO and DX as examples of heels who sold merchandise. I'm saying they're not heels. They weren't stereotypical babyfaces, but they were booked as the heroes, thus: not heels.

Miz is a heel. He, nor any other current heel, sell anywhere near what Cena sells. It's laughable to compare the two.

[conman823]

Cena is not turning heel anytime soon. Miz is filling that role just fine right now.

Rock will "heel it up" before mania.

[TripleSkeet]

People keep bringing up shit like NWO and DX as examples of heels who sold merchandise. I'm saying they're not heels. They weren't stereotypical babyfaces, but they were booked as the heroes, thus: not heels.

Miz is a heel. He, nor any other current heel, sell anywhere near what Cena sells. It's laughable to compare the two.

They were booked as HEROES???? WTF were you watching?????

What constitutes a heel???? Always losing??? How was DX not heels exactly? Before Mania 14 they were feuding with Austin and were booed to death....all while still selling TONS of DX shirts.

NWO? They did everything a heel is supposed to do. People liked them because they were entertaining, not because they were booked a certain way. That whole argument is retarded. The examples I gave were of heels that moved alot of merch and who the crowd liked regardless of what they were. Sure they eventually became good guys because unlike with Cena, Vince used to listen to the crowd and let them dictate who was a good guy and who wasnt.

Read up on old storylines. They did everything they could to have Austin be the heel in his feud with Bret Hart, the crowd just didnt want to boo him. So they changed him. Same with The Rock when he was 1st a good guy.

My point is if Cena turned heel Monday I think he would still move plenty of his merchandise.

[cougarjake13]

They were booked as HEROES???? WTF were you watching?????

What constitutes a heel???? Always losing??? How was DX not heels exactly? Before Mania 14 they were feuding with Austin and were booed to death....all while still selling TONS of DX shirts.

NWO? They did everything a heel is supposed to do. People liked them because they were entertaining, not because they were booked a certain way. That whole argument is retarded. The examples I gave were of heels that moved alot of merch and who the crowd liked regardless of what they were. Sure they eventually became good guys because unlike with Cena, Vince used to listen to the crowd and let them dictate who was a good guy and who wasnt.

Read up on old storylines. They did everything they could to have Austin be the heel in his feud with Bret Hart, the crowd just didnt want to boo him. So they changed him. Same with The Rock when he was 1st a good guy.

My point is if Cena turned heel Monday I think he would still move plenty of his merchandise.



if they did the heel turn right theyd prob lose the kids but youd get the adults who boo the fuck outta him now and they have the buying power

i realize the parents of the kids do now but honestly what are there more of ... those parents or hardcore adult fans

[TripleSkeet]

if they did the heel turn right theyd prob lose the kids but youd get the adults who boo the fuck outta him now and they have the buying power

i realize the parents of the kids do now but honestly what are there more of ... those parents or hardcore adult fans

Im sure he would lose a percentage of the kids but I dont even think it would be 25%. Most kids when they start watching wrestling find a wrestler they like and it sticks with them. These kids been on him for 5 years, they arent gonna just totally stop getting his shit because he turns. Not to mention the spinning belts and wristbands are pretty cool by wrestling merchandise standards.

[cougarjake13]

Im sure he would lose a percentage of the kids but I dont even think it would be 25%. Most kids when they start watching wrestling find a wrestler they like and it sticks with them. These kids been on him for 5 years, they arent gonna just totally stop getting his shit because he turns. Not to mention the spinning belts and wristbands are pretty cool by wrestling merchandise standards.



also they may not even realize the turn

[StanUpshaw]

Yay! Talking!

[paulisded]

The idiotic "whassup" guy gets to be in the #1 contender series? Wow, the talent level has seriously fallen.

[StanUpshaw]

Awesome Kong promo!!!!


Seriously...they should give her a fucking title shot.

[StanUpshaw]

What kind of no-DQ TNA bullshit is this? Awful.

[StanUpshaw]

Dear god, poor Danielson. A charter member of APPLE. Christ almighty.

[StanUpshaw]

Edge lost his smile?

[paulisded]

R. Truth is terrible.

[StanUpshaw]

R. Truth is terrible.

Name something about that show that wasn't terrible.

[Tenbatsuzen]

Wow, this could be the first company-forced retirement I've seen. Hopefully, since Edge had mentioned that he wanted to retire soon anyway, he's got all of his money well taken care of.

I think the obvious solution if he still wants to be a part of the business is a commentator, but I don't think he has any kids/family to go home to like HBK.

[conman823]

The idiotic "whassup" guy gets to be in the #1 contender series? Wow, the talent level has seriously fallen.

Dear god, poor Danielson. A charter member of APPLE. Christ almighty.

R. Truth is terrible.

All of this is true

[Fallon]

Edge retiring really bummed me out, he's always been a favorite of mine.

Apple = Job squad 2011

[TripleSkeet]

The idiotic "whassup" guy gets to be in the #1 contender series? Wow, the talent level has seriously fallen.

It was supposed to be Morrison, but now hes got heat on him in the back because he was a dickhead to Trish Stratus at Wrestlemania.

[brettmojo]

It was supposed to be Morrison, but now hes got heat on him in the back because he was a dickhead to Trish Stratus at Wrestlemania.
Deets?

[MIKEYDAKEN]

It was supposed to be Morrison, but now hes got heat on him in the back because he was a dickhead to Trish Stratus at Wrestlemania.

haha J-MO is a cuckold!

[TripleSkeet]

haha J-MO is a cuckold!

I know I heard about all that shit with Batista!!! Unreal.

[paulisded]

I know I heard about all that shit with Batista!!! Unreal.

I need to hear more about this.

[StanUpshaw]

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[MIKEYDAKEN]

I need to hear more about this.

http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2011/0410/538472/john-morrison/
this is where i heard about it

[brettmojo]

Holy shit where was this Val Venis hiding?

[conman823]

It was supposed to be Morrison, but now hes got heat on him in the back because he was a dickhead to Trish Stratus at Wrestlemania.

If Morrison was gone from company tomorrow I wouldn't miss him a minute.

Trade him for AJ Styles

[conman823]

Holy shit where was this Val Venis hiding?

Mother Fuckin Val went off!
Love the backstage dirt!

[TripleSkeet]

If Morrison was gone from company tomorrow I wouldn't miss him a minute.

Trade him for AJ Styles

Hes 1000 times better then R Truth.

[conman823]

Not that I am a fan of R Truth but he's better in the ring. A veteran, and connects with the fans better.

Starship pain is the worst finishing move ever.

[TripleSkeet]

Not that I am a fan of R Truth but he's better in the ring. A veteran, and connects with the fans better.

Starship pain is the worst finishing move ever.

He only connects with the kids. Because he shouts out a stupid catchphrase that means nothing. And everyone sings along. I really dont get people that dont see how chessy his whole act is. The best thing about anything hes done is when Punk was beating his ass and looked out into the crowd and screamed WHATS UP? His matches are like ambien. Now they are giving him a little push but hes gonna be the 2011 version of Rikishi.

As far as finishers go, its no worse then Jeff Hardys, and hes been a mutliple world champion.

[paulisded]

I take it that tonight's Morrison victory means he kissed some major ass the last few days.

[Kevin]

I think thats the oddest heel turn in my 20+ years of watching wrestling..

[paulisded]

I think thats the oddest heel turn in my 20+ years of watching wrestling..

Exactly...a bi-polar smoker?

[Kevin]

Exactly...a bi-polar smoker?

Where they chanting THATS A NEGRO?

[paulisded]

Where they chanting THATS A NEGRO?

I think so, but my favorite idiocy were the people screaming "what about the children?" as he was smoking.

[NickyL0885]

Where they chanting THATS A NEGRO?

That's Illegal, they were chanting.

[StanUpshaw]

I just turned it on...whud I miss?

[StanUpshaw]

"Cara's face bounced off the ring apron!"

Hmmmmmmm...something's off about that.

[TripleSkeet]

I take it that tonight's Morrison victory means he kissed some major ass the last few days.

I hope so. R Truth showed tonight he has no idea how to be anything more then a mid-carder. What the fuck was that??? Talking to himself? Smoking a cigarette??

Also, I wonder what exactly JR did to Vince that just about every week hes on tv he never gets the better of anyone and he is just constantly humiliated.

[NickyL0885]

I hope so. R Truth showed tonight he has no idea how to be anything more then a mid-carder. What the fuck was that??? Talking to himself? Smoking a cigarette??

Also, I wonder what exactly JR did to Vince that just about every week hes on tv he never gets the better of anyone and he is just constantly humiliated.

Didn't JR go to a UFC event or something like that? I know that's why in the beginning thing before they show the WWE logo, they took our JR's voice and put in Cole's.

[TripleSkeet]

Didn't JR go to a UFC event or something like that? I know that's why in the beginning thing before they show the WWE logo, they took our JR's voice and put in Cole's.

Meh, this has been going on long before that. Going all the way back to making him join the Kiss my Ass club to when they pretended to pull stuff like Mae Youngs fake hand and an Oklahoma football helmet out of his asshole.

[conman823]

I think thats the oddest heel turn in my 20+ years of watching wrestling..

It was the heel turn nobody wanted or cared about.
The both of them spent 20 minutes putting on a show worthy of NXT at best.

As far as JR and Lawlers angle, what is the end game? Does Cole go to Smackdown or Lawler? I don't believe JR is coming back full time. The only one who is benefiting from any of this is Josh Matthews. He's an acceptable option for me because I can't stand Cole and will never get JR back.

[Bob Impact]

Meh, this has been going on long before that. Going all the way back to making him join the Kiss my Ass club to when they pretended to pull stuff like Mae Youngs fake hand and an Oklahoma football helmet out of his asshole.

That was after Kane lit him on fire as well. This is just basically how they involve JR in angles, he gets shit on.

[NickyL0885]

How long before Cena is back on RAW?

[styckx]

How long before Cena is back on RAW?

Before RAW goes off the air.

[Kevin]

Why is this loser getting a Push.

he is TERRIBLE.

[NickyL0885]

Why is this loser getting a Push.

he is TERRIBLE.

WHAT'S UP?!

[Kevin]

WHAT'S UP?!

SHUT UP!

[sarsbusdriver]

Nice Raw t-shirt Mr. Truth.
Every good heel turn features brand loyalty.

[StanUpshaw]

Kharma!?

Could there be a shittier name?

[StanUpshaw]

I wanna give Layla a hug. :glurps:

[NickyL0885]

Wow. Gutting the RAW roster of its two biggest faces.

[Sue_Bender]

Why is Smackdown so happy to get Cena and Orton, and Raw so sad to see them go?

I'd be happy to get them off my show.

They're gonna run over everyone on Smackdown.

Yuck.

[styckx]

I wish Cole was drafted to unemployment so we don't have to suffer through his awful programs anymore.

[StanUpshaw]

JR got a little stiff!

[StanUpshaw]

Who's this jobber fighting Randy?

[epo]

Is Randy Orton growing a heel beard? And who cut/colored Dolph Ziggler's hair?

[Bob Impact]

styckx you son of a bitch.

[styckx]

Before RAW goes off the air.

http://i572.photobucket.com/albums/ss167/RocKomedy1/Colbert/Colbert-ICALLEDIT.gif

[StanUpshaw]

Before RAW goes off the air.

:ohmy:

[TripleSkeet]

Raw still lost. They lost Sin Cara and Orton and got Big Show, Mysterio and Del Rio. (Del Rio being the only good adddition).

[Bob Impact]

Raw still lost. They kept Cena and lost Sin Cara and Orton and got Big Show, Mysterio and Del Rio. (Del Rio being the only good adddition).

Fixed that for you.

[TripleSkeet]

Fixed that for you.

I cant stand Cenas gimmick, but he is a legit main eventer and losing him without getting another true full time ace like HHH in his place would be detrimental to Raw.

[Tenbatsuzen]

If anybody would like a laugh, go to google image search, search "stephanie mcmahon boobjob" without the quotes, and look at the first page of results.

[StanUpshaw]

If anybody would like a laugh, go to google image search, search "stephanie mcmahon boobjob" without the quotes, and look at the first page of results.

Not only did I get a laugh, I got a boner!

[disneyspy]

the saggy brest one looks like eddead guerros wife

[cougarjake13]

i like this one






http://celebritymound.smugmug.com/photos/468016489_jsQFh-M.jpg

[brettmojo]

I was reading the Raw recap on With Leather and this made me loff and loff...

Morrison had me for a moment. He was lying on the ground with his arm python’d around his neck, trying to get up without the help of the trainers, EMTs, referees down. I was buying that Truth’s attack had severely hurt his neck, and the screaming kids in the first few rows agreed with me. Then, as if he was giving me the middle finger through my television set, Morrison flipped his hair back to get it out of his face, using only his neck. I felt like the manager from Slap Shot when this happened. “WHAT’RE YA DOOOOIN’?!”

So, to recap, here is a list of things John <nobr style="color: rgb(43, 101, 176);" id="itxthook2w2nobr" class="itxtrst itxtrstnobr itxthooknobr">Morrisonhttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/mag-glass_10x10.gif</nobr> (http://withleather.uproxx.com/2011/05/the-best-and-worst-of-wwe-raw-52-happy-dead-osama-bin-laden-day/3#) doesn’t understand:
1. How friends work
2. How girlfriends work
3. How pro wrestling works
4. How to speak without sounding like a fat 11-year old
5. How necks work

[conman823]

Epic and accurate

[cougarjake13]

hes nvr gonna be above mid carder and prolly gone in a yr or 2

[NickyL0885]

That's the truth! (rolls eyes)

[TripleSkeet]

That's the truth! (rolls eyes)

The sad part is, the very end, where he came out of nowhere to blast Mysterio, was the only part of Raw that didnt bore me. It was so unexpected and not the way they do things anymore. Reminded me of the old days, if just for a second.

[styckx]

Know what you mean. It was the first time in ages I actually didn't see something coming.

A contrast to that, and annoying was when they played a replay of Kharma on Smackdown and then went right to a womans match after it. Like gee, I wonder if Kharma will come out for this match. Surprising to no one she did exactly that 2 entire minutes later.

[paulisded]

Know what you mean. It was the first time in ages I actually didn't see something coming.

A contrast to that, and annoying was when they played a replay of Kharma on Smackdown and then went right to a womans match after it. Like gee, I wonder if Kharma will come out for this match. Surprising to no one she did exactly that 2 entire minutes later.

Is Kharma the gigantic black woman? If so, her storyline sucks, as does all "female monster" angles. Ok, the entire women's division stinks. But you have a complete roster of skinny little girls with questionable (at best) ability, and every couple of years they bring in somebody like Kharma. There's not much you can do with this storyline. Yes, she's going to demolish everybody she touches, with the only potential deviation being somebody she develops an obsession over. Eventually, she'll be defeated at a PPV, and that will be the end of her usefulness outside of a couple of return matches.

[brettmojo]

Is Kharma the gigantic black woman? If so, her storyline sucks, as does all "female monster" angles. Ok, the entire women's division stinks. But you have a complete roster of skinny little girls with questionable (at best) ability, and every couple of years they bring in somebody like Kharma. There's not much you can do with this storyline. Yes, she's going to demolish everybody she touches, with the only potential deviation being somebody she develops an obsession over. Eventually, she'll be defeated at a PPV, and that will be the end of her usefulness outside of a couple of return matches.
Chyna what?

Beth Phonix what?

[styckx]

Is Kharma the gigantic black woman? If so, her storyline sucks, as does all "female monster" angles. Ok, the entire women's division stinks. But you have a complete roster of skinny little girls with questionable (at best) ability, and every couple of years they bring in somebody like Kharma. There's not much you can do with this storyline. Yes, she's going to demolish everybody she touches, with the only potential deviation being somebody she develops an obsession over. Eventually, she'll be defeated at a PPV, and that will be the end of her usefulness outside of a couple of return matches.

The Goldberg affect.

TNA at least had women who could work a match and take legitimate bumps so it wasn't a gimmick killer for Kong when she did lose. Gail Kim and Beth Phoenix are about the only chicks on the WWE roster who could work a match with Kong and have it not seem fucking retarded if they actually won. The rest are just highlight reels for botch mania videos on youtube.

She'll probably end up squashing the womens division, have a PPV match with Beth, then slip into a Chyna sorta role of working inter gender matches and end up in some stupid program with Santino.

[paulisded]

Chyna what?

Beth Phonix what?


The Chyna thing worked longer because of the Dgeneration shit. Beth Phoenix was bigger than the others but nothing like this bitch, and her stock dropped once she was beat. The only way out is the mismatched couple storyline with somebody like Santino.

[StanUpshaw]

This might have already been done at some point in WWE history, but I think that when Alberto Del Rio is cutting a heel promo, instead of chanting "WHAT?", the audience should chant "QUE?"