OFFICIAL 2004 PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE THREAD

[TheMojoPin]

Live it.

Know it.

Love it.

Use it.

First things first...why are we as a nation STILL tolerating these humps getting the questions and topics ahead of time so they can "practice?!?" This is so much like the 9th grade debate team it's embarassing.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Tall_James]

It ain't no debate without Ralph!

<img src=http://www.christpuncherrecords.com/sigs/layla.jpg>
[center]"Freakshow Makes...Tall James Takes"

[blakjeezis]

This is so pitiful, embarassing, painful, and pathetic. These two con men are gonna dance for us tonight and try and get us to call their tune. I hate this system; I hate this process; I hate these parties. I'm insulted by it, as should you all be, and it's about Goddamn time it changed!

<IMG SRC =http://members.hostedscripts.com/randomimage.cgi?user=blakjeezis>
If I were any better, I'd have to be twins!!
<marquee><font color=red>INRI</font> White people are so scared of blakjeezis<font color=red> INRI</font></marquee>
Split bones sticking out of her virgin, white gown/She spread herself out like butter when she smacked the ground.

[Freakshow]

strategery

<center><img width=300 src=http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=Freakshow>
Thanks Furtherman, SatCam, Reefdweller, and Monsterone!<br>We don't need a cure we need a final solution</center>

[BoondockSaint]

from Letterman:

Top Ten George W. Bush Debate Strategies


10. Ask the question, "We've never had a horse-faced president so why start now?"

9. Instead of witty retorts, have secret service wrestle Senator Kerry to the ground.

8. Use Kerry's long-winded answers to take much needed bathroom breaks.

7. Hope one of them hurricanes cancels the debate.

6. Instead of water, fill Kerry's mug with Red Bull and vodka.

5. Find time to work in joke prop--giant waffle.

4. Moving his lips to pretend microphone isn't working.

3. Handle it same way he handled national guard duty--don't show up.

2. If Kerry makes a good point, distract him with some chaw spit in the eye.

1. Point out Senator Kerry's mispronunciation of the word "nucular."


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/squrl/piazzazakk.jpg
M1 is the shit!

This message was edited by BoondockSaint on 9-30-04 @ 11:22 AM

[peacefrog081]

OFFICIAL PRESEDENTIAL DEBATE DRINKING GAME THAT I THOUGHT EVERYONE MIGHT LIKE:


The Official 2004 Presidential Debate Drinking Game

Let's face it. The presidential debates are a nuisance. But for whatever
reason, most television networks feel obliged to carry them.

So stop your whining and make the best of a bad situation with the
Official 2004 Presidential Debate Drinking Game. All you have to do is
line up your favorite beverage and pick a candidate. Then let the game
begin:

- Every time President Bush says the word "safer," take a drink. If he
uses the word "democracy" in the same sentence, make it a double.

- For every John Kerry reference to the UN, have a drink.

- If Bush uses the phrase "compassionate conservative," you must chug
your entire beverage.

- Take one drink for every three times Kerry points with his left hand.

- Any previously recorded Bushism, like "misunderestimate" or
"subliminable," used by the president during the debate requires one
drink.

- If Kerry exceeds the time limit for any response, take a drink.

- Back-to-back offenses require a double shot and a NoDoz.

A reference by your candidate to any of the following requires one
drink:

1) Florida

2) North Korea

3) Axis of evil

4) Saddam Hussein

5) The American people

- And for an exciting twist on the game, anytime anybody mentions the
word "Vietnam," everybody has to take a drink.

In this game, everyone's a winner. At worst, you'll reach the end of the
debate experiencing a warm, pleasant buzz. But if you're really lucky,
you'll pass out by 10 o'clock and won't have to listen to the closing
statements. Cheers!


<img src="http://members.aol.com/latinspicexox/images/peacrfrogwhitesig.jpg">

[IrishAlkey]

This has the potential to be funnier than SNL in the last 10 years.

<center>http://artemis.gamedaemons.net/alkey.gif</center>

[NewYorkDragons80]

1. Point out Senator Kerry's mispronunciation of the word "nucular."
http://www.newgenevacenter.org/portrait/carter.jpg
This guy pronounces it "nucular" and he used to work on a "nucular" submarine. Go figure.

<marquee>
"To insist on strength is not war-mongering. It is peace-mongering." -Senator Barry M. Goldwater "If gold should rust, what will iron do?" -Geoffrey Chaucer "Worship him, I beg you, in a way that is worthy of thinking beings.-Romans 12:1</marquee>
<img src=http://members.aol.com/cityhawk80/images/nydragonssig.bmp?mtbrand=AOL_US>

[curtoid]

Two links I go to every day:

Electoral Vote Predictor 2004 (http://www.electoral-vote.com/) - Updated every day with the latest numbers from across the US of A.

PollingReport.com (http://pollingreport.com/) - Is your one stop shop for most of the polls out there.



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/curtoid/curt4_sig.jpg


"Don't believe everything you read on message boards." - RB

[BoondockSaint]

Oh and Letterman said that Bush insited that one of the rules be, that after he answers a question the moderator must say, "Good point Mr. President. Now, what do you think, wrinkletard?"

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/squrl/piazzazakk.jpg
M1 is the shit!

[monsterone]

This has the potential to be funnier than SNL in the last 10 years.

<center>http://artemis.gamedaemons.net/alkey.gif</center>


billy staples at red bank was funnier than snl in the last 10 yrs.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="gray" size="1">do you know what "nemesis" means? a righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent.
personified in this case by an 'orrible cunt... me.
</font>

</center>
<font color= "red" size="6">

[TheMojoPin]

Oh and Letterman said that Bush insited that one of the rules be, that after he answers a question the moderator must say, "Good point Mr. President. Now, what do you think, wrinkletard?"

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/squrl/piazzazakk.jpg
M1 is the shit!

No, that was "Bush" on Conan's show.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[BoondockSaint]

Jesus! You're right. How the hell did I mix that up?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/squrl/piazzazakk.jpg
M1 is the shit!

[badorties]

Presidential Debate Bingo

How to play: Print out a page for each person you'll be watching the Presidential Debate with. (You may wish to print out several pages if you plan on playing more than one round.) Be sure to refresh this page every time you print, as the squares are assigned randomly each time.

If President Bush or Senator Kerry say the phrase, bring up the topic, or do the action marked on a square, mark off that square. The first person to mark off an entire row (either horizontally, vertically, or diagonally) and shout BINGO wins. It's fun and edumacational! (http://www.planetsocks.com/bingo.asp)


<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=badorties"><br>

+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+|+

[Yerdaddy]

That bingo came rocks. These were especially funny: http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/73.gif http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/10.gif http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/69.gif http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/115.gif http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/121.gif http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/13.gif http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/103.gif http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/47.gif

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=bonedaddy5">
Fuck it from behind.

This message was edited by Yerdaddy on 9-30-04 @ 7:11 PM

[Cybersoldier]

Nader should be apart of this debate even if he has to have hell itself to freeze over for him to win the white house in this election

<IMG SRC="http://publish.hometown.aol.com/cybersoldiernyc/myhomepage/cs_sig.jpg?mtbrand=AOL_US">
Thanks for the sig monsterone

[HBox]

http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/78.gif
http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/139.gif
http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/52.gif
http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/82.gif
http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/81.gif
http://www.planetsocks.com/graphics/bingo/107.gif

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[walking joint]

nothing delivers a good night sleep more than a presidential debate...ZZZZZZZZZZZZ

<img src="http://hometown.aol.com/satelitecam/images/sig_wk.jpg">
thanks for the sig SatCam...and thanks for bringing it back Furie

[SpicyMcHaggis]

This debate is gonna decide for me who I want to vote for.

This is my first time voting as I just registered yesterday. One of the many eighteen year olds that are.



"And I never will play the Wild Rover no more."

The Book of Mike (http://www.mikeythemallrat.blogspot.com)

I'm not Shamus McFitzy.

This message was edited by SpicyMcHaggis on 9-30-04 @ 7:43 PM

[HBox]

Last night on the Daily Show there was a funny bit where Ed helms read his pre-written debate report. Luckily we don't live in a world where the media is actually that far gone...............

CORAL GABLES, Fla. Sept. 30, 2004 - After a deluge of campaign speeches and hostile television ads, President Bush and challenger John Kerry got their chance to face each other directly Thursday night before an audience of tens of millions of voters in a high-stakes debate about terrorism, the Iraq war and the bloody aftermath.

The 90-minute encounter was particularly crucial for Kerry, trailing slightly in the polls and struggling for momentum less than five weeks before the election. The Democratic candidate faced the challenge of presenting himself as a credible commander in chief after a torrent of Republican criticism that he was prone to changing his positions.

Bush was expected to confront questions about leading the nation into war on the still-unproven premise that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. He also has faced accusations that he lacked a strategy to deal with the violence and chaos that have left more than 1,000 Americans dead and that the Iraq war has diverted U.S. attention from al-Qaida and other terrorists.

With a record of four years in office to defend, Bush had a debate strategy of being optimistic about Iraq but acknowledging that times were tough. His stance is that Americans know he is a decisive leader even if they don't always agree with his decisions and that Kerry has taken conflicting positions on Iraq and can't be trusted to lead the nation.

Although Kerry voted to give Bush authority to invade Iraq, he says he would not have followed Bush's path to war a path that alienated allies and, the Democrat says, left Americans less secure. Kerry argues Bush is out of touch with reality, paints too rosy a picture about Iraq and lacks a strategy to end the crisis.

Kerry also says Bush has neglected other major problems like North Korea and Iran, two nations suspected of pursing nuclear weapons.

Kerry, in a taped interview on ABC's "Good Morning America" on Thursday, said, "George Bush is scaring America. He's talking terror every day, and people see terrible images of what's happening in the world, and they're real."

Bush spent the morning comforting hurricane victims on his fifth survey of Florida areas hit by storms. At the Martin County, Fla., Red Cross center, Bush thanked volunteers for showing "the true heart of America. We long to help somebody when they're hurting."

The debate's focus on Iraq was sharpened by bombings in Baghdad Thursday that killed three dozen children.

Ahead in the polls, Bush could afford to settle for a debate draw while Kerry needed something to break the status quo. Some Democrats saw the debates as the last chance for a Kerry breakout.

Thursday night's meeting at the University of Miami was the first of three Bush-Kerry debates over a two-week period. Neither side was underestimating its importance with a TV audience of 30 million to 40 million expected. Almost a third of people surveyed say the debates will be a deciding factor in how they vote.

The first debate drew the nation's attention to hurricane-battered Florida and its political importance. Florida swung the presidency to Bush in the disputed 2000 election and could determine whether he wins re-election.

The debates were staged under a rigid set of rules negotiated by the candidates' representatives to limit spontaneity and opportunities for back-and-forth exchanges.

Screenshots. (http://annatopia.com/pics/mm/abc/debate1.bmp)
here. (http://annatopia.com/pics/mm/abc/debate2.bmp)
And here. (http://annatopia.com/pics/mm/abc/debate3.bmp)

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[monsterone]

woo who!!!!!!!1 big ass simulcast, sort of.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="gray" size="1">do you know what "nemesis" means? a righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent.
personified in this case by an 'orrible cunt... me.
</font>

</center>
<font color= "red" size="6">

[BoondockSaint]

The two of them, so far, couldn't win a high school debate.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/squrl/piazzazakk.jpg
M1 is the shit!

[42nd-delay]

Looks like networks aren't kowtowing to the ridiculous debate rules - numerous "reaction shots" so far.

------------------------------
"42nd-delay is the only person who's making sense." - Ron, 3-12-02

[newport king]

"we're looking for saddam, i mean osam...excuse me, binladen."

<img src="http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/newportking.jpg">

[BoondockSaint]

I caught that too

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/squrl/piazzazakk.jpg
M1 is the shit!

[BoondockSaint]

Did Kerry color his eyebrows?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/squrl/piazzazakk.jpg
M1 is the shit!

[Reephdweller]

"we're looking for saddam, i mean osam...excuse me, binladen."


It's not really a Bushism though, Kerry did the very same thing in his answer as well.

<center><IMG SRC="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=3">
Reefy's website... (http://www.osirusonline.com/)</center>
<font size="1" color="red">
<center>Check out The Ron and Fez Show Logs...UPDATED!!!!! (http://www.osirusonline.com/ronfez.htm)</center>
<marquee behavior=alternate bgcolor="#FFFFFF">Right now you could care less about me...
but soon enough you will care, by the time I'm done</marquee> </font>

[42nd-delay]

"[We'll never win in Iraq until Iraqi citizens feel they have to take matters into their own hands to protect themselves.]"

Probably could have phrased that better...

------------------------------
"42nd-delay is the only person who's making sense." - Ron, 3-12-02

[Katylina]

Bush keeps repeating the same thing over and over-- about how the soliders must feel for saying wrong place, wrong time.

<center>

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=katylina">
<a href="http://www.pagerealm.com/katylina/index.html" target=_new>Katylina's Web Page</a>
<br>
<br>
<marquee>I have no desire to make windows into men's souls.</marquee>

[newport king]

i also liked, "thats a pre september 10th way of thinking."

<img src="http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/newportking.jpg">

[Katylina]

Is that September 9th? hehhe

<center>

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=katylina">
<a href="http://www.pagerealm.com/katylina/index.html" target=_new>Katylina's Web Page</a>
<br>
<br>
<marquee>I have no desire to make windows into men's souls.</marquee>

[BoondockSaint]

Who told Kerry to pretend to write something? It looks so bad.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/squrl/piazzazakk.jpg
M1 is the shit!

[Katylina]

"I see on the TV screen how hard it is." What the fuck is that! The greatest leaders are THERE with the troops-- not watching it on TV.

<center>

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=katylina">
<a href="http://www.pagerealm.com/katylina/index.html" target=_new>Katylina's Web Page</a>
<br>
<br>
<marquee>I have no desire to make windows into men's souls.</marquee>

This message was edited by Katylina on 9-30-04 @ 9:35 PM

[donjuan]

Although he's still clinging to that "middle of the road" Clintonian tack, it seems as if Kerry is finally trying to distinguish himself from Bush. Too little too late? It's a real shame Howard Dean isn't opposite the president tonight.

http://hometown.aol.com/mm3jb/images/donjuan2.jpg
"The only difference between me and a madman is that I'm not mad."
- Salvador Dali

[Reephdweller]

How many times can Kerry point out that he served in the war?

Also, Bush looks a little weird when he's fumbling for his thoughts.

<center><IMG SRC="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=3">
Reefy's website... (http://www.osirusonline.com/)</center>
<font size="1" color="red">
<center>Check out The Ron and Fez Show Logs...UPDATED!!!!! (http://www.osirusonline.com/ronfez.htm)</center>
<marquee behavior=alternate bgcolor="#FFFFFF">Right now you could care less about me...
but soon enough you will care, by the time I'm done</marquee> </font>

[El Mudo]

Who told Kerry to pretend to write something? It looks so bad.


Maybe he should read the newspaper, like we do at Terptown during basketball games during the introduction of the opposing team...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v53/monster6sixty6/guests/elm_sig.gif
<marquee>Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum </marquee>
Thanks Monsterone!!

[newport king]

bush makes awful faces during kerry's responses. reminds me of a little kid. i'm really hoping for one of them to just utter "what a bunch of bullshit." kerry hasnt really won me over either but bush sounds like a stuttering prick.

<img src="http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/newportking.jpg">

[newport king]

hehee "peninchula"

<img src="http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/newportking.jpg">

[monsterone]

what happened to the art of public speaking???

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="gray" size="1">do you know what "nemesis" means? a righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent.
personified in this case by an 'orrible cunt... me.
</font>

</center>
<font color= "red" size="6">

[newport king]

http://www.wrestlinginformer.net/The_Fabulous_Moolah3.jpg
IRANIAN MOOLAH!??!!

<img src="http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/newportking.jpg">

[East Side Dave]

So who's watching "One Bad Trip" on MTV?

<img src=http://www.richstillwell.com/ESD.gif>
Big Ass Mafia

Click this link (http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/thenight/ppr/index.shtml) to hear my show on 90.5 The Night FM;
Friday and Saturday Night: Midnight to 5 AM you bastards!

[HBox]

we cannot succeed with mixed messages......... we cannot succeed without alliances......... we cannot succeed with mixed messages........... we cannot succeed without alliances

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[HBox]

Is he deliberately trying to avoid saying "nucular?"

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[newport king]

i think kerry came out on top. what is the group's thoughts?

<img src="http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/newportking.jpg">

[East Side Dave]

I thought Ketchup Man won. Now off to NBC for Tom Brokaw's anaRysis!!

<img src=http://www.richstillwell.com/ESD.gif>
Big Ass Mafia Edits

Click this link (http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/thenight/ppr/index.shtml) to hear my show on 90.5 The Night FM;
Friday and Saturday Night: Midnight to 5 AM you bastards!

This message was edited by East Side Dave on 9-30-04 @ 10:32 PM

[newport king]

and i find jenna bush incredibly hot for some odd reason.

<img src="http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/newportking.jpg">

[HBox]

I thought that Kerry got stronger as the deabte went on, and was at his best when discussing nuclear proliferation, and that was when Bush was at his weakest. I'm gonna take this all in, but I think kerry squeeked out a win. For all the crap he gets about no one knowing what he'd do in Iraq, I think he laid some specifics, while Bush was more "We gotta stay the course" without much specifics.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[whoopsy]

Is he deliberately trying to avoid saying "nucular?"


ha... yeah, i noticed that too

Kerry wins on a decision, not a knockout, but he presented a concise message, something I wasn't sure he was capable of

<img src='http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=whoobsy'>

[canofsoup15]

Kerry seemed really boring to me, the way he just sort've drones.

Bush isn't no spectacular speech giver but at least his long pauses and thought-processes provide some sort of anticipation for what he's going to say next.



<img src=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/Canofsoup15/Sigs/ERUZIES1.gif>

<marquee behavior=alternate><Font size="1" Color="blue">
I got the glass, I got the steel. I got the love to hate.
</font><font color=red> All I need is your head on stake.</font></marquee><Font Color = White>

[reeshy]

After watching this debacle of a debate...I guess I ain't voting this year!!!!!!

[center]<IMG SRC="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=reeshy">
[center]

[blakjeezis]

My only question after watching this is: Do you think those Bush girls ever practiced kissing on each other when they were growing up?


Man, would I put a hurtin' on both of those snotty bitches.

WHO'S THE PRESIDENT? WHO'S THE PRESIDENT? You're Goddamn skippy Blakjeezis runs this shit.

<IMG SRC =http://members.hostedscripts.com/randomimage.cgi?user=blakjeezis>
If I were any better, I'd have to be twins!!
<marquee><font color=red>INRI</font> White people are so scared of blakjeezis<font color=red> INRI</font></marquee>
Split bones sticking out of her virgin, white gown/She spread herself out like butter when she smacked the ground.

This message was edited by blakjeezis on 9-30-04 @ 10:40 PM

[East Side Dave]

At the next debate I think they should see who can pin more clothes-pins to their face! My money's on Massachusetts Boy!!

<img src=http://www.richstillwell.com/ESD.gif>
Big Ass Mafia

Click this link (http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/thenight/ppr/index.shtml) to hear my show on 90.5 The Night FM;
Friday and Saturday Night: Midnight to 5 AM you bastards!

[newport king]

Do you think those Bush girls ever practiced kissing on each other when they were growing up?

i like the way you think.

<img src="http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/newportking.jpg">

[HBox]

The Kerry girls can't practice kissing each other; their chins would get in the way.

::rimshot::

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[Reephdweller]

I think Kerry won the debate based on appearance and the forcefulness of his delivery. I don't think he won however in defining what he would do to fix the problems that he outlined. He just kept saying that he has a plan. He might want to get around to telling us how he plans on doing it. I also think Bush seemed a little too much on the defensive.

<center><IMG SRC="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=3">
Reefy's website... (http://www.osirusonline.com/)</center>
<font size="1" color="red">
<center>Check out The Ron and Fez Show Logs...UPDATED!!!!! (http://www.osirusonline.com/ronfez.htm)</center>
<marquee behavior=alternate bgcolor="#FFFFFF">Right now you could care less about me...
but soon enough you will care, by the time I'm done</marquee> </font>

[42nd-delay]

In a general sense, I thought Kerry did pretty well. I've never been so
enthusiatic about his style, but he came across pretty well, and more
focused than Bush.

They both scored some points, but overall I have to give it to Kerry.
Bush's responses tended to be vague and reliant on talking points.
Almost every question he began by fumbling a bit before locking onto
his talking point. Kerry can be a little stiff, but I think tonight it came
across as seriousness tonight.

------------------------------
"42nd-delay is the only person who's making sense." - Ron, 3-12-02

This message was edited by 42nd-delay on 9-30-04 @ 10:45 PM

[East Side Dave]

Dick Cheney reminds me of the "The Big Lebowski," not the Dude (Jeff Bridges), rather the old-man-in-the-wheel-chair-Lebowski. Just sayin'.

<img src=http://www.richstillwell.com/ESD.gif>
Big Ass Mafia

Click this link (http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/thenight/ppr/index.shtml) to hear my show on 90.5 The Night FM;
Friday and Saturday Night: Midnight to 5 AM you bastards!

[blakjeezis]

In terms of public opinion before and after, I think Kerry made more of an advance than Bush did, I guess that's just a function of Bush being already known and Kerry not so much. The average voter only knows of Kerry as a stiff, and I think he came off as fairly dynamic tonight. I know I garnered at least some respect for him, as a speaker if nothing else. I do think, though, that Bush's responses to Kerry were stronger than Kerry's responses to Bush's, so in that sense, I guess Bush won.

<IMG SRC =http://members.hostedscripts.com/randomimage.cgi?user=blakjeezis>
If I were any better, I'd have to be twins!!
<marquee><font color=red>INRI</font> White people are so scared of blakjeezis<font color=red> INRI</font></marquee>
Split bones sticking out of her virgin, white gown/She spread herself out like butter when she smacked the ground.

[FMJeff]

Stewart is ripping Bush a new ass....Kerry won and I couldn't be happier....he saved his ass with this debate...

<center><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/fmjeff.gif">
<br>
It made my heart sing.

This message was edited by FMJeff on 9-30-04 @ 11:14 PM

[HBox]

The Daily Show was being pretty "balanced" until they got to the joke about what John Kerry was writing while Bush was talking: "I am SO crushing him!" And then Stewart started lobbing softballs at Wesley Clark.

But, then again, if you are expecting to get any actual info or balance from the Daily Show, get a damn newspaper you fool!

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[reeshy]

But, then again, if you are expecting to get any actual info or balance from the Daily Show, get a damn newspaper you fool!



What paper do you recomend???? "Pravda"?????????

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[monsterone]

who needs drugs when you can watch a mind numbing debate? i thought the simulcast kinda sucked only cuz it wasn't in sync

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="gray" size="1">do you know what "nemesis" means? a righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent.
personified in this case by an 'orrible cunt... me.
</font>

</center>
<font color= "red" size="6">

[ADF]

I don't think he won however in defining what he would do to fix the problems that he outlined. He just kept saying that he has a plan


Compare how vague and repetitive Kerry was to Bush and I don't see how anyone could say that Kerry lost. Repetitive? How about "we're working hard..." "It's hard work." Blah blah blah...

Bush wants to continue the course, but the problem is that he has no idea what he's doing. We're fucked if he wins.

<center><a href="http://somesuch.org" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.somesuch.org/sigpics/heroine.gif"></a><i><br><br><b>Roses are red... Violets are blue... All of my base... Are belong to you.</i></b></center>

[HBox]

Giuliani on the Daily Show referring to Saddam Hussein: "He was a weapon of mass destruction."

They're getting very desperate. And Stewart was so much more hard on Giuliani than Clark. Giuliani seemed to be getting a little pissed at the end.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[ADF]

That whole thing about getting Saddham was a good thing is a bit of misdirection. Sure, everybody agrees that it is.. but is it worth 1000+ American lives as well as tens of thousands of Iraqi civilian lives? How about if getting Saddham wasn't the reason given for the war in the first place? It's like saying you're going to the grocery store, getting in a huge car accident, and then saying, "Hey, we got a good deal on hamburger meat, so it's a good thing!"

<center><a href="http://somesuch.org" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.somesuch.org/sigpics/heroine.gif"></a><i><br><br><b>Roses are red... Violets are blue... All of my base... Are belong to you.</i></b></center>

[FUNKMAN]

Bush said 'mixed messages' so much that he blurted out "mexed missages'...

One thing Bush said that seemed to define his thought process on validation for invading Iraq was 'we were attacked'... It reveals that he cannot come to the realization that AlQaeda/Osama and the attack of 9/11 had nothing to do with Iraq. Bombing Afghganistan showed his determination and ability to lead but going into Iraq showed his ignorance. Kerry pointed out that Bush's own Dad felt it was something to not venture into. At this point it looks like he'll be our next president. Hopefully he has learned to not make the same mistake again and again.



<img src="http://www.grandfunkrailroad.com/images/mdm100.gif">

give me all the love that's in ya and i'm gonna give you mine

[Recyclerz]

Well, I think Kerry did about as good a job as he's capable of tonight. As an admitted Kerry partisian, or more accurately as someone who doesn't like the President, maybe I can't be objective but I'm trying. However, it seemed to me that Kerry was able to articulate his answers in the context of a thought through plan for the future. You may not believe what he's saying or you could disagree with his positions but he finally articulated them in a way that wasn't hopelessly obtuse. Bush on the other hand seemed to me to be like a kid who had memorized a bunch of facts and sort of spit them out as he remembered them rather than laying them out as part of a narrative he wanted lead the audience through. He did make the occasional good point, but was never able to follow it up.

I remain convinced that Bush probably means well but is in way over his head, which does not in and of itself make him a bad person. However, his stubborn refusal to get up to speed on issues and to pull decisions out of his ass does make him a bad leader. (I'm a mid level cog in a corporation and if I did my job as badly as the President does his I'd be fired in a week.) And when his decisions lead to situations where our troops are put in harms way and over 1,000 of them get killed because of a half-assed theory and an incompetently planned follow-through I cannot find it in me to cut him any slack.



<IMG SRC="http://www.hometown.aol.com/recyclerz/myhomepage/sigpic1.gif?mtbrand=AOL_US">
[b]There ain't no asylum here.
King Solomon he never lived 'round here.[b]

This message was edited by Recyclerz on 10-1-04 @ 12:58 AM

[sxybby]

yah I know. nader lol

[reeshy]

Christ, we are doomed as a nation....I'm crying...no joke!!!!!!

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[monsterone]

Christ, we are doomed as a nation....I'm crying...no joke!!!!!!

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why?

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="gray" size="1">do you know what "nemesis" means? a righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent.
personified in this case by an 'orrible cunt... me.
</font>

</center>
<font color= "red" size="6">

[reeshy]

figure it out, Genius!!!!!

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[monsterone]

figure it out, Genius!!!!!

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[center]





i understand what you're saying, i guess. but why aren't you packing you bags and booking a flight to canada?

seriously, the world isn't going to end. it isn't like this hasn't happened before.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="gray" size="1">do you know what "nemesis" means? a righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent.
personified in this case by an 'orrible cunt... me.
</font>

</center>
<font color= "red" size="6">

[reeshy]

First of all...I don't run...second of all...that debate was horrible....I have a feeling whoever wins.....we lose!!!!!

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[monsterone]

honestly, if you want to make a difference, vote 3rd party. many will say it's a throw away vote, but we need to get to a point where americans dismantel the 2 party system.

both candidates are cut from the same cloth and it's been going on for years. check nader's site - the blue chip sponsors blocked anyone but rep & dem's from debating.

and futhermore, people that are anybody but bush and the bush hardliners are 1 in the same.

<center><img border=1 src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=monsterone01"><br></center>

<center>

<font color="gray" size="1">do you know what "nemesis" means? a righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent.
personified in this case by an 'orrible cunt... me.
</font>

</center>
<font color= "red" size="6">

[Reephdweller]

honestly, if you want to make a difference, vote 3rd party. many will say it's a throw away vote, but we need to get to a point where americans dismantel the 2 party system.

both candidates are cut from the same cloth and it's been going on for years.


I agree completely. I'd love to see both parties knocked out. If enough people voted third party it would send a very clear signal.

As for the debate, I am voting for Bush. I came to this realization over the RNC convention, however as supportive of him as I might want to be, I can tell you as an objective observer that I thought Bush was horrible on delivering his message. Frankly sometimes he scared the shit out of me with his pauses mid-sentence. I think a lot of people like to jump all over his mis-speaks but I think by now many people know that this is just the way that he is. I don't really look at that aspect as a flaw because in some ways I think he uses it to his advantage to appeal to some of the people. I'm not saying it's a good tactic but I think he does try to play that to his advantage.

I think Kerry overall did very well in comparison to Bush in terms of his speaking ability. But many times he just would say "I have a plan" but would never get into it and I think people, especially the undecided vote who are the ones who will sway this election one way or another would like to know what he would do. It's easy to say "I'll do this, or that" or get these people to do this, but HOW are you planning on doing it.

However, I think he did a great job at showing people that he is a serious candidate and should be looked at closer. I give him a lot of credit because I think his performance will help him close some of the gap between him and Bush.

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This message was edited by Reefdweller on 10-1-04 @ 6:41 AM

[SpicyMcHaggis]

As far as how they came across from the perspective of a potential voter, Kerry came across as very well thought out and had some good counterpoints while Bush seemed very cocky, repetitive, and all around unprepared, which is something the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES shouldn't be comming across as.

One moment when I actually yelled at the TV was when Bush said the soldiers still have a mission to carry out. Was it just me, or was it an illusion when I saw him fly in on a jet and land on a carrier and utter these words at the beginning of his speech, "Mission accomplished." ?!?



"And I never will play the Wild Rover no more."

The Book of Mike (http://www.mikeythemallrat.blogspot.com)

I'm not Shamus McFitzy.

[Reephdweller]

I'm not Shamus McFitzy.


http://chemsrv0.pph.univie.ac.at/hi/Spock1.jpg

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<marquee behavior=alternate bgcolor="#FFFFFF">Right now you could care less about me...
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[Reephdweller]

When Kerry said he looked at KGB records in "Treblinka Square" in a visit to Russia. Treblinka was a Nazi death camp. He meant Lubyanka Square.

Welcome to the age of Kerryisms.

<center><IMG SRC="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=3">
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<marquee behavior=alternate bgcolor="#FFFFFF">Right now you could care less about me...
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[kc7586]

Who told Kerry to pretend to write something? It looks so bad.
How about not looking at the camera at all? I may be wrong but isn't he supposed to be speaking to the american public not the fucking moderator?

And as reefy said, bush mixes words and pauses, thats just the way he is. I would definatly prefer a president who is human and mixes things a bit then a fucking orange robot.

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Good girls are bad girls that dont get caught.
Life's a bitch.....then you strangle one.

[jeffdwright2001]

Bush is so buddy buddy with International leaders that he has "pet" names for them.

He calls the leader of Russia "Vladamrrrrrrr".





<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=jeffdwright2001"><br>
"It is not best to use our morals weekdays, it gets them out of repair for Sunday." - Mark Twain 1898

Thanks to Reefy & M1 for my sigs!!

[silera]

I think this thread proves that no matter what either of the candidates say, those convinced that Iraq was a good idea will vote for Bush and those that don't will vote for Kerry or not at all.

I think Kerry won this debate and convinced many that he was more than just a vote against Bush.

One point that really struck me about last night was Bush insisting that America was not going to be led by the world in defending itself, yet admitting that in North Korea, the US pretty much left ourselves in the hands of China as far as negotiations regarding nuclear weapons were concerned. His defense that it was not to America's benefit to engage in bilateral discussions was not backed up by any evidence, and in fact is directly contradicted by the fact that North Korea is now better armed with nuclear weapons than it was prior to Bush assuming office.

I found Bush to be sincere in believing that his invasion of Iraq was the course the US needed to take to fight the war on terror, though he did not convince me that it was. However, I was never on board with the invasion of Iraq, so I will admit to bias.

I'm actually confounded that he still says Saddam was a threat even though the war proved that he did not have the WMD's.

Fact is though, that those that support Bush will continue to accept the "flip flopping" sound bytes instead of digesting that the circumstances we've had to deal with since 9-11 are much more complex than right or wrong, or good versus evil. It may be because we as a nation want to believe that we can exact revenge and win, for our national pride.

I say that a lot of undecided, will consider Kerry as a more viable leader after last night, and I look forward to the debates on the economy and national policy because while Bush certainly has public sentiment behind him on foreign affairs, his domestic leadership has been more than lacking.

I'd hope that in the end, Kerry will prove that he can deliver a fiscally responsible, economically sound and fair government. Last night gave me hope.


<center>http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/silerass.jpg
<font size="3" color="red">AND WHAT?</font></center><font color="FBF2F7">

[Furtherman]

Bush said, "The enemy attacked us".

Saddam did not attack us. Iraq did not attack us.

It's still neck and neck, and too early to tell, but this gives me hope as well:

SOURCE: Gallup Poll News Service
CONTACT INFORMATION: Media Relations 1-202-715-3030
Subscriber Relations 1-888-274-5447
World Headquarters
901 F Street
Washington, DC 20004

October 01, 2004
Kerry Wins Debate
Viewers also more favorable to Kerry, but opinions about Iraq and military leadership still favor Bush


by David W. Moore

GALLUP NEWS SERVICE

PRINCETON, NJ -- John Kerry won the debate Thursday night, 53% to 37%, according to a random sample of 615 registered voters who watched the event. Almost half of the viewers said they felt more favorable about the senator because of the debate, and 60% said Kerry expressed himself more clearly than did President Bush.


Kerry Wins Debate (http://www.gallup.com/poll/content/?ci=13237)

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...with thanks to JustJon

This message was edited by Furtherman on 10-1-04 @ 10:32 AM

[angrymissy]

I was cringing watching Bush fumble and whine last night. I almost felt bad for him. That whole bit about the woman whose husband died in Iraq and how he wanted to "love" her more was creepy. Repeating over and over how everything is "hard work". Wow, being the president, is like, hard. I don't want to hear my president complaining about how "hard" everything is. And don't forget about Poland!

Kerry STOMPED him. I was kind of eh about him before, but after watching last night, I believe he will make an effective leader.

Poll numbers from CNN.com:

Overall, 53 percent of Thursday's debate watchers interviewed said Kerry did the better job, compared with 37 percent who favored Bush.



<BR><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/missy2.gif" width="300" height="100" border="1">

This message was edited by angrymissy on 10-1-04 @ 10:41 AM

[TheMojoPin]

I found Bush to be sincere in believing that his invasion of Iraq was the course the US needed to take to fight the war on terror, though he did not convince me that it was.

That's the key point for me. I have no doubt Bush THINKS he made the right decision when it comes to Iraq 100%...but belief doesn't make it the RIGHT decision. He's mistaken decisiveness for stubborness, and it's just murdering our international standing and alliances, and THAT'S what downright terrifies me. I couldn't give a damn about his poor speaking skills, or how he looks, or how Kerry looks...I'm simply looking at who's not going to kick sand in the face of the rest of the world over the next four years, because if we continue on that path, we're going to pay dearly for it within the next decade.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[silera]

He's mistaken decisiveness for stubborness, and it's just murdering our international standing and alliances, and THAT'S what downright terrifies me.

I couldn't agree more.

If only the voting public would start coming to the same conclusion.

<center>http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/silerass.jpg
<font size="3" color="red">AND WHAT?</font></center><font color="FBF2F7">

[FUNKMAN]

when Bush was asked about how he 'miscalculated' on the Iraqi war his answer was:

"well they didn't stand there and fight, i thought Saddam's armies would stand there and fight but instead they retreated and blended into the cities" not word for word but it's pretty close.

This 'frikin' idiot(tryin to say it nicely) has not learned anything from the Vietnam War or a war just 10 years earlier in Kuwait. The Iraqi soldiers in Desert Storm retreated and in Vietnam the soldiers blended in with the citizens.

How the FUCK did this guy graduate college? Is college that fucking easy? But i guess you do not need common sense to get through college...

I can't wait to see the 'domestic' debate and his reasoning for giving the richest people in America the largest tax break and then later saying that the richest people have lawyers and accountants and if Kerry begins to tax the richest that the middle class will wind up paying for it...

give me a fucking break!

<img src="http://www.grandfunkrailroad.com/images/mdm100.gif">

give me all the love that's in ya and i'm gonna give you mine

[mdr55]

Just imagine how Bush talks to world leaders on his own:

We ah.......understand your position....ah but......we feel that.......for the safety of the......United States.....that uh......I know it's hard work........I know Iraq didn't attack the United States......but......they ah.....attacked my dad......so.......what were we talking about again?.......um....I don't understand the question.


God that was killing me and he stupid smirk or half grin when he speaks.

[jeffdwright2001]

Both Kerry and Bush read their two minute prepared closing statement from teleprompters.

I noticed no discernable difference in Kerry's language/style from when he was answering questions and making comments during the debate.

Bush on the other hand, suddenly became more well spoken, coherent in thought progression, and used imagery not even hinted at in the previous 88 minutes of debate.

Bush can't take his speech writers with him when he has the one on one conversations with the leaders of the world and he really can't pull off an Eliza Dolittle.



<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=jeffdwright2001"><br>
"It is not best to use our morals weekdays, it gets them out of repair for Sunday." - Mark Twain 1898

Thanks to Reefy & M1 for my sigs!!

[TheMojoPin]

I would really like to hear the candidate's opinions on Native American tribal sovereignty.

http://www.campchaos.com/show.php?iID=868

Which candidate can at least APPEAR to know his shit when it's not fed to him? It's becoming woefully apparent which one that is. Oh, but God forbid he changes his mind over his president's idiot policies and decisions.

But hey, don't vote for Kerry...he's tan and has wrinkles!

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 10-1-04 @ 1:43 PM

[A.J.]

One moment when I actually yelled at the TV was when Bush said the soldiers still have a mission to carry out. Was it just me, or was it an illusion when I saw him fly in on a jet and land on a carrier and utter these words at the beginning of his speech, "Mission accomplished." ?!?

President Bush Announces Major Combat Operations in Iraq Have Ended
Remarks by the President from the USS Abraham Lincoln
At Sea Off the Coast of San Diego, California

Major combat operations in Iraq have ended. In the battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have prevailed. And now our coalition is engaged in securing and reconstructing that country...We have difficult work to do in Iraq. We're bringing order to parts of that country that remain dangerous. We're pursuing and finding leaders of the old regime, who will be held to account for their crimes. We've begun the search for hidden chemical and biological weapons and already know of hundreds of sites that will be investigated. We're helping to rebuild Iraq, where the dictator built palaces for himself, instead of hospitals and schools. And we will stand with the new leaders of Iraq as they establish a government of, by, and for the Iraqi people...The transition from dictatorship to democracy will take time, but it is worth every effort. Our coalition will stay until our work is done. Then we will leave, and we will leave behind a free Iraq. (http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/05/iraq/20030501-15.html)

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[FMJeff]

Bush said 'mixed messages' so much that he blurted out "mexed missages'...


Classic...i loved that...

Bottom line, Bush got served. Period.

Anyone who could still support this 'stammering for a witty retort' simpleton doesn't deserve to vote.

Don't trust polls btw. Poll numbers are bought and sold every day, I guarantee it. They are meaningless to me.

I only hope vote numbers are not bought and sold as well.

<center><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/fmjeff.gif">
<br>
It made my heart sing.

[SatCam]

I've been recently looking at the bigger picture. Bush and Kerry are just a face for each party. They just represent their party's platform. If Republicans want tax breaks for the rich, Bush will approve it. If Dems want $1Bil for healthcare, Kerry will approve it.

And this is why, if I was able to vote, I would first of all, factor out Kerry. The democrats are, in my opinion, a bunch of people who take money when they need it. Want to build a new building? Your taxes are going up. Don't worry, we'll just tell you that you'll benifit in the long run.

I agree with the republican's platform moreso, but they don't produce.

Both parties will limit your freedoms and control where your money goes. Some of you are right; both of these guys are two in the same. There's nothing wrong with having two parties with similar views, but I just can't comprehend why these are the two parties.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig89_general_snoopdog.jpg" align="right" alt="Nigguh pleeze" /><a href="http://www.satelitecam.tk">Ron and Fez Drops and Bits</a>

50%[color=white]

[HBox]

ignore my dumbass mistake.

This is on the heels of an article published on FoxNews.com this morning with a bunch of falsified quotes from Kerry.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 10-2-04 @ 12:54 AM

[TheMojoPin]

I don't get it?

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[HBox]

Ignore the photo. Some websites were alleging that Fox News edited the photo to make Bush look bigger than he was, and I was an idiot and didn't look at it closely enough. In fact, I'm just gonna get rid of it.

As far as the false quotes in the Fox news article, here they are.

"Women should like me! I do manicures."

"Didn't my nails and cuticles look great? What a good debate!"

"I'm metrosexual - [Bush's] a cowboy."

These quotes were atrributed to kerry in an artile posted this morning on Fox News by Carl Cameron, Kerry campaign reporter for Fox. More details here. (http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/week_2004_09_26.php#003555)

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 10-2-04 @ 12:59 AM

[shamus mcfitzy]

I am Shamus McFitzy

such a bland debate that I'm drooling over the VP one. That will actually entertain me and might actually MEAN something. Like if Edwards wins, it means that he just beat the brains of the Bush ticket at a debate rather than when Kerry beats Bush and the Republican party already has a statement ready that essentially says that Bush is an imbecile so we shouldn't be surprised. I can only hope that people in Ohio, Iowa, New Mexico, and ESPECIALLY New Hampshire actually watch all three debates and then go vote.

I don't know if my brain can actually take a loss of like 1 electoral vote this time around. It could really kill me.

my favorite part of the debate by the way was when Bush said that he understands the costs of war because he gets the casualty reports everyday. Its great when he points out the one fact that Kerry can kill him with.

And I supported the Iraq War, Silera, and I'm for Kerry. I supported the war in 1991 though...

This message was edited by shamus mcfitzy on 10-4-04 @ 1:02 AM

[GodsFavoriteMan]

The democrats are, in my opinion, a bunch of people who take money when they need it. Want to build a new building? Your taxes are going up. Don't worry, we'll just tell you that you'll benifit in the long run.

I agree with the republican's platform moreso, but they don't produce.

Both parties will limit your freedoms and control where your money goes. Some of you are right; both of these guys are two in the same. There's nothing wrong with having two parties with similar views, but I just can't comprehend why these are the two parties.

The only people who don't want money for the government are the Libertarians, yet, they believe in a strong defense, so how they'd accomplish that without a tax code is beyond me. Otherwise, Bush has spent an ugodly amount of billions on this war and has lowered taxes (most of which benefit the wealthy) and that doesn't make sense. People complain of Democrats tax and spend policies, well at least during Clinton's term there was a balanced budget and a surplus. So obvsiously we weren't spending more than what was taxed. Now we have a rediculous defecit because Bush's policies are fiscally irresponsible. Is that what you prefer? Is that the Republican platform that benefits you best? If you're in the upper 10% of Americans benefitting from the tax cuts, then I suppose you have reason to support Bush, but as far as I'm concerned, these tax cuts hardly affected me at all. And the socio-economic benefit has been nil.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/GFMSIG_copy.jpg" width="300" height="107"></p>
"All I wanted was a Pepsi!"

[TheMojoPin]

Ah, but under Clinton, the Democrats only controlled the White House. The Republicans should get their credit for that "balanced budget and surplus economy" since they were the majority everywhere else.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[GodsFavoriteMan]

I thought about including that in my argument, but since the Balanced Budget was a bipartisan issue it kind of cancelled itself out. But, yes, they do deserve credit, as does the entire congress and senate for passing budgets that didn't get out of hand.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/GFMSIG_copy.jpg" width="300" height="107"></p>
"All I wanted was a Pepsi!"

[sr71blackbird]

That's the key point for me. I have no doubt Bush THINKS he made the right decision when it comes to Iraq 100%...but belief doesn't make it the RIGHT decision.


No to derail, but if our invasion of Iraq was based upon faulty information that Iraq posed a threat to us, then it would seem a justifiable reason for war. Despite that we havent found any WMD's obviously illustrates that our information was crap, we just cant pull out of there now without it tumbling into chaos and make us look like even bigger idiots to the rest of the world. We have to fix what we messed up, its the only fair thing to do. Now, the issue is who should be in the white house for the next 4 years?

If Bush wins, its going to fall on his party to fix the mess
If Kerry wins, its going to fall on his party to fix the mess

Who is going to want to take on that responsibility?

<center>
http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=8 </center>


<center><B>My Thanks to Just Jon, Reefdwella, ADF, Yerdaddy,Monsterone and Katylina for the sig-pic help and creation!</B></center>
<marquee behavior=alternate><font size=1>Which Witch Wished Which Wicked Wish?</marquee>

[A.J.]

Ah, but under Clinton, the Democrats only controlled the White House. The Republicans should get
their credit for that "balanced budget and surplus economy" since they were the majority everywhere else.


You forget that from January 1993 to January 1995, the Democrats controlled the White House and both houses of Congress. It was the health care debacle that led to the Republican Revolution of 1994 and the GOP takeover of Congress. It also forced Clinton to the center. It was mutual really.

<img src=http://img40.photobucket.com/albums/v124/Canofsoup15/Sigs/AJinDC-Sig.jpg>

A Skidmark/canofsoup15 production.

Red Sox Nation

[silera]

Shifty Tax Cuts: How They Move the Tax Burden off the Rich and onto Everyone Else (http://www.faireconomy.org/Taxes/HTMLReports/Shifty_Tax_Cuts.html)

That website is absolutely great.

Bill Gates is like my new Jesus Christ.


<center>http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/silerass.jpg
<font size="3" color="red">AND WHAT?</font></center><font color="FBF2F7">

[mdr55]

Despite that we havent found any WMD's obviously illustrates that our information was crap, we just cant pull out of there now without it tumbling into chaos and make us look like even bigger idiots to the rest of the world.


Thank goodness they didn't watch the debate. Who knows what they would think if they saw Bush's "hard work" during the debate. At least Bush admitted he knows that Iraq didn't attack the U.S. after his "We were attacked" statement.

[curtoid]

Great news from DCRTV (http://www.dcrtv.com)...

10/4 - News Blues reports that Fox News Channel has pulled Carl Cameron, its top DC-based political reporter, off the campaign of Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry after Cameron posted fake Kerry quotes on the Rupert Murdoch-owned news network's website last Friday. John Moody, Fox News senior VP of newsgathering, says he has suspended Cameron from all reporting duties, effective immediately. Cameron will be replaced on the Kerry campaign by another DC-based reporter, Major Garrett. Moody adds that Fox News has sent a letter of apology to the Kerry campaign, and has started a review of "internal editing teams" at the cable news channel's website. More in DCRTV's 10/1 newsblurb.....

I think Cameron is the same guy seen in the "Outfoxed" advocacy documentary against FOX News praising Bush off camera before an interview, and even mentioning that his wife works for his campaign - I think it's him.





http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/curtoid/40.jpg
"One of our normal friends." - RB

[silera]

Fox should apologize for how unfunny the spoof was.


<center>http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/silerass.jpg
<font size="3" color="red">AND WHAT?</font></center><font color="FBF2F7">

[angrymissy]

VP Debate tonight... maybe Cheney will get pissed and either have a heart attack or start cursing out John Edwards

Should be interesting

<BR><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/missy2.gif" width="300" height="100" border="1">

[HBox]

All I know about tonight is that it will end with one of the moderators ending up frozen in carbonite, John Edwards losing a hand and Dick Cheney telling him that he's his father.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[FUNKMAN]

i hope Edwards deosn't come off as some 'country bumpkin goober'...

if Cheney tries to pull off the 'lack of experience' thing all Edwards has to say to Cheney is "how much experience did you have as VP before being elected?"... pops

<img src="http://www.grandfunkrailroad.com/covers/redalbum100.gif">

[marygrace]

wow, i thought i was the only person who felt it odd that Bush kept using the phrase "it's hard" or "it's hard work". Ron just made a reference to that on air.

[Recyclerz]

I'm not sure which I would prefer from Cheney - a Jack Nicholson/A Few Good Men type of freak-out ("Of course we invaded Iraq for the oil, you SUV driving pussy") or that he gets so flummoxed that he has a pull a Larry David/Curb Your Enthusiam fake heart attack to get outta the hall. :)

<IMG SRC="http://www.hometown.aol.com/recyclerz/myhomepage/sigpic1.gif?mtbrand=AOL_US">
[b]There ain't no asylum here.
King Solomon he never lived 'round here.[b]

[high fly]

I wanna see Edwards kick chain-chain-Cheney in the nuts and then dare him to sue...





" and they ask me why I drink"
http://64.177.177.182/katylina/highflysig.jpg
Big ups to sex bomb baby Katylina (LHOOQ) for the sig!

This message was edited by high fly on 10-5-04 @ 8:42 PM

[Furtherman]

All throughout the debate, Bush was seen taking notes on a piece of paper at his podium. At great risk to life and limb, we were able to smuggle out the notes and present them so that they are available for everyone to see.
Many Bothans died to bring you this information ...


Bush's Debate Notes (http://www.thatsuncalledfor.com/debate_notes/)



<IMG SRC="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=7">
...with thanks to JustJon

[Freebird]

It's probably all a big show by Fox to show that they do discipline their reporters for running false stories, unlike other organizations (CBS).

I've seen more subtlety in wrestling angles.

-----------------------------
Now I'm starving

I'm about to turn it up a notch!

[HBox]

Why is George Bush yelling at everybody?

He just laid the smack down on CHarles Gibson.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 10-8-04 @ 9:31 PM

[LordJezo]

That was awesome!

Bush is furious!

------------------------
I KISS YOU!

[SatCam]

That had me on the floor!!!!

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig89_general_snoopdog.jpg" align="right" alt="Nigguh pleeze" /><a href="http://www.satelitecam.tk">Ron and Fez Drops and Bits</a>

50%[color=white]

[Zipgun]

I'm surprised Bush didn't do a Chris Rock move and throw the mic on the floor.

<img src=http://atamichimpo.50megs.com/images/skidmarkgacysig.jpg>

[color=White]

[SatCam]

Someone in the audience behind George has boxing gloves and a towel.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig89_general_snoopdog.jpg" align="right" alt="Nigguh pleeze" /><a href="http://www.satelitecam.tk">Ron and Fez Drops and Bits</a>

50%[color=white]

[HBox]

<font size="20">HEALTH CARE!!!!!!!!!!!! LAWYERS!!!!!!!! TORT REFORM!!!!!!!!!! GRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!<font size="1">

These have been some good question though.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[HBox]

Holy shit. I can see this turning into a campiagn ad four years from now if Kerry is elected.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 10-8-04 @ 9:54 PM

[SatCam]

"Look at the guy, who's uhh, running, for the president of the, uh united states."

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig89_general_snoopdog.jpg" align="right" alt="Nigguh pleeze" /><a href="http://www.satelitecam.tk">Ron and Fez Drops and Bits</a>

50%[color=white]

[HBox]

Wanna buy some wood?

I suspect he's lying, but that was pretty funny.

I am biased here, but I think Bush just got hammered on Stem Cells.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 10-8-04 @ 10:18 PM

[HBox]

I haven't been a good judge of these, but I think that Kerry romped tonight. Bush was yelling at everybody for the first hour, and finally calmed down on his weakest positions. he still has that aura of "I can't believe you don't agree with me! What is wrong with you! Why I am wasting my time here!" I thought he did better than I expected on health care, but everywhere else he looked bad, especially on stem cells.

And, did I just hear Bush use the word "haters" in his closing remarks?

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[SatCam]

I wish this format was a weekly installment.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig89_general_snoopdog.jpg" align="right" alt="Nigguh pleeze" /><a href="http://www.satelitecam.tk">Ron and Fez Drops and Bits</a>

50%[color=white]

[LordJezo]

Bush was amazing tonight.. he came out strong and didn't stop swinging.

Good work Mr. President! Score one for the good guys this time. You sank Kerry.

------------------------
I KISS YOU!

[newport king]

son of a bitch i missed it tonight...who won?

<img src="http://hometown.aol.com/bonedaddy5/images/newportking.jpg">

[SatCam]

Yankees and Sox.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/SatCam/sig89_general_snoopdog.jpg" align="right" alt="Nigguh pleeze" /><a href="http://www.satelitecam.tk">Ron and Fez Drops and Bits</a>

50%[color=white]

[LordJezo]

son of a bitch i missed it tonight...who won?


It's split down the middle. The libs say Kerry, the right wingers say Bush.

Bush was out swinging tonight and didn't let down. The complaints are that Bush was too angry and too attacking. According to the people after the first debate Bush wasn't attacking enough and didn't swing at all.

Oh well.

------------------------
I KISS YOU!

[mikeyboy]

It's split down the middle. The libs say Kerry, the right wingers say Bush.


Well, duh. Welcome to the spin machine.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=mikeyboy">
Ron & Fez Show Log (http://www.osirusonline.com/ronfez.htm)
Just because you don't listen doesn't mean I don't have a radio show
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[HBox]

The complaints are that Bush was too angry and too attacking. According to the people after the first debate Bush wasn't attacking enough and didn't swing at all.

He was angry in both. Instead of expressing it in angry scowls, this time he expressed it by yelling at everybody for an hour.

BTW, if conservatives can go around mocking Al Gore for "inventing the internet," I''m going to go around mocking Bush for "proposing the hydrogen car."

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 10-8-04 @ 11:11 PM

[FMJeff]

The complaints are that Bush was too angry and too attacking. According to the people after the first debate Bush wasn't attacking enough and didn't swing at all.

He was angry in both. Instead of expressing it in angry scowls, this time he expressed it by yelling at everybody for an hour.

BTW, if conservatives can go around mocking Al Gore for "inventing the internet," I''m going to go around mocking Bush for "proposing the hydrogen car."

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 10-8-04 @ 11:11 PM

Yeah I heard that.

Hoo hoo i invented nuclear power.

<center><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/fmjeff.gif">
<br>
It made my heart sing.

[Recyclerz]

I don't think anybody's mind got changed by this debate tonight, there was more heat than light. I thought the person who did the best was the guy who asked them what they were going to do about the deficit.

Although I disagree with 90% of what Bush has done and is doing I will give him credit for one thing. He didn't lose the election tonight, which almost happened when he lost his shit when Kerry kept challenging him on Iraq. He was able to get his composure back and go back to what is his strength, his facile charm and li'l jokes.


<IMG SRC="http://www.hometown.aol.com/recyclerz/myhomepage/sigpic1.gif?mtbrand=AOL_US">
[b]There ain't no asylum here.
King Solomon he never lived 'round here.[b]

This message was edited by Recyclerz on 10-8-04 @ 11:23 PM

[mdr55]

He was able to get his composure back and go back to what is his strength, his facile charm and li'l jokes.


Is that all it takes to be President? Who knew. No wonder the rest of the world is watching the debates.......it's the #1 comedy in America.

http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/rids/20041001/i/r1242700601.jpg
(I know I don't have lumber but I'm getting a Woody right now)

This message was edited by mdr55 on 10-8-04 @ 11:45 PM

[mdr55]

Best part of the debate:

Questionee: If given the keys to drive America....how would you drive?

Bush: I'd tell everyone to step back because I'm going to put the pedal to the metal. And if your in my way, ya'll better watch out cuz this car ain't stopping!

Kerry: I have a plan. If I'm in a 65 mph zone I'll drive 65. If I'm in a 30 mph zone I'll drive 30 mph. It's best to remember that you can drive fast if you want to but you also have to consider safety. And that's something this president wouldn't do.

Bush: Flip-flopper! At least people know where I stand. 65 mph or 30 mph.....which one is it?

Kerry: There is no easy choice.

Bush: Yes there is. You're either fast or your not. What's so hard about that. Thank you questionee for that question. And when I get that hydrogen car down the road, by betcha I'll be spinning the wheels of that son-of-a-gun.

[TheMojoPin]

"I wasn't happy when we found out there wasn't weapons," Bush said. "But Saddam Hussein was a unique threat. And the world is better off without him in power. And my opponent's plans lead me to conclude that Saddam Hussein would still be in power, and the world would be more dangerous [if Kerry had been president]."

Uh...whut?

Kerry fired back, saying the president's policies have left Americans with a huge bill for the war in Iraq.

"If we'd used smart diplomacy, we could have saved $200 billion and an invasion of Iraq, and right now Osama bin Laden might be in jail or dead. That's the war on terror."

Hmm.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[mdr55]

the 3rd debate format should have been a Presidential Big Ass night of Fights. Bush vs. Kerry winner take all.

Just imagine the closing statement of the winner: "I just kicked the shit out of my opponent, and I'll make sure I'll fight for America and kick the shit out of the terrorists."

[Recyclerz]

My favorite weird moment was when Bush came out hard on one of the burning issues of the day - he opposes the Dred Scott decision, dagnabbit! and the judges that wrote it!

Mr. President, I'm with you on that one.



<IMG SRC="http://www.hometown.aol.com/recyclerz/myhomepage/sigpic1.gif?mtbrand=AOL_US">
[b]There ain't no asylum here.
King Solomon he never lived 'round here.[b]

[HBox]

And then it got even weirder when Kerry said he opposes "Taxation without representation!"

The great threat to our country is that these haters end up with weapons of mass destruction.

I was right. Transcript here. It's at the end. (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,134937,00.html)

Hate the game, not the player, B.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 10-9-04 @ 12:45 AM

[TheMojoPin]

Bush got winded from all the shoutin', so he powered up with a nice long swig of HATERADE, Limp Bizkit-style!

"Yo, why this mic pointed at my grill like a gun, bitch?!?"

http://www.ktab.co.uk/news/passenger200402/uselections.jpg

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[HBox]

MICHAELSON: Mr. President, if there were a vacancy in the Supreme Court and you had the opportunity to fill that position today, who would you choose and why?

BUSH: I'm not telling.

(LAUGHTER)

I really don't have -- haven't picked anybody yet. Plus, I want them all voting for me.

http://www.hep.ucl.ac.uk/~ytl/personal/images/Shocked.jpg

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[mdr55]

After watching tonight's debate, I decided that I'm going to vote for Bush.....................because he's against slavery. ;p

Damn did he struggle with that question or what.


The more I watch the debates the more juvenile the candidates look. It's like watching a middle school election:

Bush: Vote for me because I got balls to kick peoples' butt. Just yesterday I gave Saddam the beat down. My opponent is chicken. He doesn't have the guts to fight. Chicken little, chicken little.

Kerry: Will you stop that. Don't call me names or I'm going to tell the teacher. If you elect me class president I promise that we won't have homework for the rest of the year, I have a plan to put a little extra 50-cents in your pockets and I'll talk to my mom to get the other parents involved and we can have one big party where EVERYONE is invited. Even you George.




God help us. Which ever candidate wins, America loses in the end.

[GodsFavoriteMan]

God help us. Which ever candidate wins, America loses in the end.



Good lord, this has been said so many times through so many elections that it's lost all meaning. Especially since America hasn't ended. Think about the Great Depression. That was about as bad as it got here. The on top of that we got hit in Peal Harbor. America is far too resilient to "lose" because of a president. Though, I have to admit, Bush has tried his damndest to piss off the rest of the world.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/GFMSIG_copy.jpg" width="300" height="107"></p>
"All I wanted was a Pepsi!"

[Zipgun]

I wasn't happy when we found out there wasn't weapons


Excellent job of transcribing the President's quote Mojo, however it does need to be corrected.

I wuddn't happy when we found out there wuddn't weapons

<img src=http://atamichimpo.50megs.com/images/skidmarkgacysig.jpg>

[color=White]

[East Side Dave]

I thought this was the best debate yet- maily 'cause they were allowed to walk around on the stage. I hope in the next debate they have to go through an obstacle course like "Double Dare" or that bloody, fucking ripoff- "Funhouse."

<img src=http://www.richstillwell.com/ESD.gif>
Big Ass Mafia

Click this link (http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/thenight/ppr/index.shtml) to hear my show on 90.5 The Night FM;
Friday and Saturday Night: Midnight to 5 AM you bastards!

[TheMojoPin]

I wasn't happy when we found out there wasn't weapons


Excellent job of transcribing the President's quote Mojo, however it does need to be corrected.

I wuddn't happy when we found out there wuddn't weapons

Ah, touche...very true, Skid.

And he owns a mansion and a yacht.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[mikeyboy]

Has anyone reported on what was behind the "lumberyard" exchange between Kerry and Bush?

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=mikeyboy">
Ron & Fez Show Log (http://www.osirusonline.com/ronfez.htm)
Just because you don't listen doesn't mean I don't have a radio show
The Music Mikey Likes Show on radiobbq, weekdays 12-2 (http://www.live365.com/stations/radiobbq)

[TooCute]

I don't know about the lumberyard but as far as that whole "Let me finish" bulge under the jacket thing is concerned, somebody's gone so far as to make a website:
<a href="http://www.isbushwired.com/">http://www.isbushwired.com</a>

Don't they have better things to do with their time? Even if he was wired, it certainly didn't help him!

<img src="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/bans/toocute3.gif">

[mdr55]

When Bush was asked to list 3 mistakes, he refered to 2 people but didn't want to name names. Who was he thinking about?


I like how the only mistake he stated was that it was something trivial like forgeting to put his slippers on or missing a doctor appointment or something.

[Teenweek]

Has anyone reported on what was behind the "lumberyard" exchange between Kerry and Bush?



nypost:
There were a few light moments - when Kerry claimed that Bush "got $84 from a timber company" and thus counted as a small business, Bush replied quizzically: "I own a timber company? That's news to me. Need wood?"

[FUNKMAN]

i seriously think i couldn't stand watching another debate. it's like two children arguing about who is gonna ride in the front seat or who tagged the other last...



<img src="http://www.grandfunkrailroad.com/covers/closer100.gif">

[Recyclerz]

As to the $84 lumberyard reference

Factcheck.ORG (http://factcheck.org/article.aspx@DocID=265.html)

Don't worry - it doesn't go to George Soros' website on the "internets"

<IMG SRC="http://www.hometown.aol.com/recyclerz/myhomepage/sigpic1.gif?mtbrand=AOL_US">
[b]There ain't no asylum here.
King Solomon he never lived 'round here.[b]

[angrymissy]

<img src="http://www.youforgotpoland.com/prez.jpg">

<BR><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/missy2.gif" width="300" height="100" border="1">

[DarkHippie]

Was it just me, or when Kerry was answering his last question, did Bush look like he was gonna rush him?

<IMG SRC=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/Canofsoup15/Sigs/HippieRat.jpg>
<marquee> Check out DarkHippie's latest story, "Keeper", at http://home.pcisys.net/~drmforge/dftoc2.htm </marquee>

[Cybersoldier]

<img src="http://www.youforgotpoland.com/prez.jpg">

<BR><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/missy2.gif" width="300" height="100" border="1">


I'm surprise Clinton was who those guys with the quote "What did I do wrong?" with a woman next to him

<IMG SRC="http://publish.hometown.aol.com/cybersoldiernyc/myhomepage/cs_sig.jpg?mtbrand=AOL_US">
Thanks for the sig monsterone

[shamus mcfitzy]

not like I had to point this out, but checking back at this site, http://www.electoral-vote.com has Kerry pulled ahead in Iowa, Wisconsin, and Nevada since the VP debate. What happens if Kerry wins NM and NH for example, leaving the electoral votes tied?

[curtoid]

So.....

Does there need to do a repeat of the first debate for John Kerry to stand a chance in November?



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/curtoid/20.jpg
"One of our normal friends." - RB

[Reephdweller]

What happens if Kerry wins NM and NH for example, leaving the electoral votes tied?



Bush wins by way of a Supreme Court vote?


<center><IMG SRC="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=3">
Reefy's website... (http://www.osirusonline.com/)</center>
<font size="1" color="red">
<center>Check out The Ron and Fez Show Logs...UPDATED!!!!! (http://www.osirusonline.com/ronfez.htm)</center>
<marquee behavior=alternate bgcolor="#FFFFFF">Right now you could care less about me...
but soon enough you will care, by the time I'm done</marquee> </font>

[HBox]

If there's an electoral tie, the House of Representatives votes to decide, and since it will be held by Republicans, that means 4 more years. It would be nice to think that maybe they would defer to popular vote, since that MAKES SENSE, but I'm not that naive.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[HBox]

This is horribly boring, much more so than the last 3. This is awful, I don't know who the fuck is winning. Bush was smiling and happy for the first half, but he has reverted to screaming since and the smile is gone. Bush is speaking much better than the last 2 debates as well.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[spoon]

I find it amazing that the host to this debate is an old business partner with GWB. They worked together in fucking over the people of Texas with the Rangers and the stadium.


<img src="http://members.aol.com/dxixrxt/spoon2.jpg">
And you may not like it! But you will learn to love it!

[Reephdweller]

I think it's a draw, they're both dullards.

I am also convinced one way or the other we're fucked.

<center><IMG SRC="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/randomizer/random.php?uid=3">
Reefy's website... (http://www.osirusonline.com/)</center>
<font size="1" color="red">
<center>Check out The Ron and Fez Show Logs...UPDATED!!!!! (http://www.osirusonline.com/ronfez.htm)</center>
<marquee behavior=alternate bgcolor="#FFFFFF">Right now you could care less about me...
but soon enough you will care, by the time I'm done</marquee> </font>

[HBox]

I was proud of myself. I watched every single debate and watched them in full without switching channels even though Yankee games were on every time. Well, this borefest broke me. I'm trying to be Mr. Responsible Citizen, but I can't do it. I feel like I've heard these answers already. The only part that got my attention is when Bush gave an explanation of what he says is a problem with the current health system. And he basically crapped all over the concept of health insurance. He didn't come out and say that, but what he described was health insurance. That made my heart stop. I hope people pick up on that, it was VERY disturbing to me.

It was also amusing when Kerry explained in detail why his health plan wasn't a government takeover and then Bush just started spouting the same shit he always said. Looked a bit foolish there.

Other than that, this thing has made me comatose.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[GodsFavoriteMan]

So what's the Yankees/Redsox score now??

Oh yeah, the debate. . .

What can I say? It's still going.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/GFMSIG_copy.jpg" width="300" height="107"></p>
"All I wanted was a Pepsi!"

[HBox]

That was an interesting exchange.

Kerry: McCain is my bitch!
Bush: Let me remind Mr. Kerry that Mr. McCain is supporting me, so he's MY BITCH!

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[GodsFavoriteMan]

Why does Bush always sound like he's about to cry?

I have a painting by a friend in *sniffle* of mine and Laura's of *sob* West Texas and it reminds me of *snort* my optimism for the United States.
Why don't you just love me?

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/GFMSIG_copy.jpg" width="300" height="107"></p>
"All I wanted was a Pepsi!"

[HBox]

That was a draw, I guess. Yankee time.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[whoopsy]

i, for one, was glad to hear that with my job being outsourced at the end of the year (and with 50% of my division outsourced last month), that I will be eligible for some community college classes in math and science, and that education is the answer..

i definitely don't lay blame on Bush for outsourcing, (just bad luck to have picked comp. sci), but what kind of response is this (and i don't need no community college to know that I'll rip Bush a new ass hole in math and science).


<img src='http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=whoobsy'>

[El Mudo]

If there's an electoral tie, the House of Representatives votes to decide, and since it will be held by Republicans, that means 4 more years. It would be nice to think that maybe they would defer to popular vote, since that MAKES SENSE, but I'm not that naive.




is there any precedent for them to defer to the popular vote? I know in 1877 when it was tied between Tilden and Hayes, Hayes made a deal with the Southern Democrats where if they voted for him, he would end reconstruction and end the occupation of the South...I believe Tilden had the popular vote if im not misaken

And besides, why would they vote for someone that wasn't in their party to be in the white house..unless Kerry makes a deal with them like in '77 and that ain't gonna happen...

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Thanks Monsterone!!

[HBox]

I'm just being an idealist. It would be nice, in the case of an electoral tie, that representatives would look at the popular vote and say, "It looks like the will of the people is Candidate X since he got more votes." Of course it's not gonna happen, but it would be the right thing to do.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[GodsFavoriteMan]

it would be the right thing to do.

And the right way to do it.

http://rds.yahoo.com/S=96062883/K=oatmeal+quaker/v=2/SID=e/l=IVS/SIG=11hd24el7/*-http%3A//www.quakerinfo.com/images/oatmeal.jpg

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"All I wanted was a Pepsi!"

[jalonz]

i think this debate was so serious it lost a lot of people. if disjointed, over-complicated explanations of insurance are a test of worthiness, then we have two winners.

why does Kerry never defend himself during the debates when Bush brings up his attendance record?

why cant Bush give a straight answer about Roe vs. Wade?

are they really able to get away with not answering the tough questions?

[TooCute]

I know we had a question about wives and daughters... but was there a question about the environment somewhere in there that I missed?

What the fuck?

<img src="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/bans/toocute3.gif">

[keithy_19]

No one cares about the enviorment toots. Just like no one cares about womens rights!



I kid of course. I dunno. What I saw though was that a lot of people said Bush won the debate and possibly the election tonight.

http://64.177.177.182/katylina/tarasig.jpg

[smiler grogan]

who are these people and where did you hear them?

[jalonz]

bush banging his hand on the lectern while he talked really opened him up to the "pulpit-pounding right" jokes tomorrow morning.

[Patches]

Jesus was the real winner last night, folks.

What a waste of 10 minutes listening to these 2 ass-clowns talk about how important their faith is to them.

I don't give a shit.

Issues motherfuckers.

<img src=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v72/bcqueens/shooter.jpg>

For example: Kindest Regards, Your Name

[curtoid]

What I saw though was that a lot of people said Bush won the debate and possibly the election tonight.

Hmmmm...just a hunch...you were watch FOX "News" right? Because they were the only ones who were crowing that Bush had clearly won.

CNN - A CNN/USA Today/Gallup snap poll taken immediately after the presidential debate found that respondents gave a significant edge to Kerry over Bush, 52 percent to 39 percent.

MSNBC - Their unscientific poll / 65% Kerry & 35% Bush

ABC - Among registered voters who watched the debate, 42 percent called Kerry the winner, 41 percent said Bush won and 14 percent called it a tie. That's similar to the outcome of the second debate, while Kerry won the first among viewers by a nine-point margin.The audience for the third debate was a bit more Republican in its allegiance: Among viewers, 38 percent identified themselves as Republicans, 30 percent as Democrats and 28 percent as independents. That makes the draw more of an accomplishment for Kerry.

CBS - Did a poll of only undecideds/uncommitted voters; 39 percent who watched Wednesday's third and final presidential debate felt Sen. John Kerry won, though nearly as many (36 percent) thought the result was a tie, and about one-quarter gave the debate to President Bush.



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/curtoid/20.jpg
"One of our normal friends." - RB

[curtoid]

I know we had a question about wives and daughters... but was there a question about the environment somewhere in there that I missed?

What the fuck?

Nope. Nothing on the environment.

And Bush ignored four questions and instead spittled his way through his pat response on education.

NO TREE LEFT BEHIND!


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/curtoid/20.jpg
"One of our normal friends." - RB

This message was edited by curtoid on 10-14-04 @ 10:02 AM

[curtoid]

Tom Shales, television critic from the Washington Post, who (after 9/11) has been VERY kind to the President, had this to say today:

An essentially dignified and thoughtful performance by Sen. John Kerry, contrasted with an oddly giggly turn by President Bush, combined to give the last debate of the presidential campaign to the challenger last night, but very narrowly.

Round 3: Bush Grins, Spins but Doesn't Win (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A31374-2004Oct14.html)



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/curtoid/22.jpg
"One of our normal friends." - RB

[TooCute]

That reminds me of the biggest nonsequitor of the night.
"Do you think the minimum wage should be raised?"

"I think that my no child left behind act is working! Education is important!!"

<img src="http://www.chaoticconcepts.com/bans/toocute3.gif">

[Recyclerz]

Now I'm not saying Kerry won the debate (and possibly the Presidency) last night

but this guy is. (http://slate.msn.com/id/2108121/)

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[b]There ain't no asylum here.
King Solomon he never lived 'round here.[b]

[IrishAlkey]

Bush was a giggling fucking fool last night. I don't care which way you lean politically, but anyone who doesn't think this guy is just awful at debating needs to find a sad, lonely NYU student and hold their hand before they take the final plunge.

<center>http://artemis.gamedaemons.net/alkey.gif</center>

[GodsFavoriteMan]

He was giggly, yes, but as I said before, it also sounded like he was on the verge of tears at times.

Hmm. . . sounds like our boy was drunk.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/GFMSIG_copy.jpg" width="300" height="107"></p>
"All I wanted was a Pepsi!"

[Reephdweller]

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20041014/capt.nvjc10410141808.bush_nvjc104.jpg

Nobody loves me!!!

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[mdr55]

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20041014/capt.nvjc10410141808.bush_nvjc104.jpg


Who let the nigge,,,,,I mean African amercians in here. This meeting is by invitation only.

[FMJeff]

nonsequitor


Bush is the king of nonsequitors. I don't believe I've ever heard so many "no duh" statements come out of a person's mouth in such a short time.



<center><img src="http://thereisnogod.faithweb.com/images/fmjeff.gif">
<br>
It made my heart sing.

[shamus mcfitzy]

well I don't know, but since I posted that http://http://www.electoral-vote.com/ site two days ago, Kerry is freefalling. I don't know if the site is just fucking random but the fact that Kerry lost like 7 points in key states according to their numbers definitely shows that somehting has happened. NJ has dropped to even, he fell back down in Iowa and Wisconsin and is losing New Mexico by even more when he was gaining.

I thought Kerry saying he'd raise the minimum wage would be huge. But people are stupid so even though like half of Ohio is sitting on their couchs watching Oprah they won't respond.

I think theres a site out there that lets you vote as a Floridian. I really think Florida or Ohio are must wins now whereas I thought Kerry could squeeze out a win without them before.

[FUNKMAN]

He was giggly, yes, but as I said before, it also sounded like he was on the verge of tears at times.


he's just sending them mexed missages again...

<img src="http://www.grandfunkrailroad.com/images/3dflagsdotcom_gfr_2fawl.gif">

[GodsFavoriteMan]

well I don't know, but since I posted that http://http://www.electoral-vote.com/ site two days ago, Kerry is freefalling. I don't know if the site is just fucking random but the fact that Kerry lost like 7 points in key states according to their numbers definitely shows that somehting has happened. NJ has dropped to even, he fell back down in Iowa and Wisconsin and is losing New Mexico by even more when he was gaining.


He posts the most recent polls from different polling groups. The states where he's lost are incongruous with his previous gains. The webmaster says he doesn't trust their numbers. And interestingly enough, when you isolate the polling group, all the battleground states it polled has bush up by an average of about 8%. Take that as you may, but it seems just a bit fishy to me.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/GFMSIG_copy.jpg" width="300" height="107"></p>
"All I wanted was a Pepsi!"

[HBox]

I have 28 new polls today from a variety of organizations. One newcomer is the Chicago Tribune, which naturally focuses on the Midwest. In their polls (conducted by Market Shares), Kerry is now ahead in three key states: Minnesota, Ohio, and Wisconsin, with Bush ahead in Iowa. All are close though. On the other hand, Strategic Vision reports Bush leading in Ohio, Iowa, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin and tied in New Jersey. Tonight's debate in Arizona could be crucial as it will be the last time the voters see the candidates together. Be sure to watch. If ARG runs 30 polls again as they did in the past, I will have their report tomorrow.

Bush has gained the upper hand in the electoral college for the moment. He picked up Iowa and Wisconsin and brought New Jersey to a tie as a result of three new Strategic Vision (R) polls there, which are slightly more recent than the Chicago Tribune polls. I started to average the recent polls, but so many people complained, I dropped the idea. To compare the pollsters, see the pollsters page. Personally, I have my doubts about Strategic Vision, but I am sticking to my rule of using the poll with the most recent middle date, and breaking ties in favor of the shortest poll, and averaging tied shortest polls. The raw data, as usual, is available by clicking the Polling data link to the right of the map. If you want to make your own averages, the data is available there.

This is what he wrote when those polls went up. Kerry is behind, but it isn't that bad. Florida looks out of reach, but Ohio looks possible for Kerry. Pennsylvania looks good for Kerry. It looks like whoever takes Ohio wins.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[shamus mcfitzy]

well if the numbers are just skewed and not plain wrong, then the site would lead me to believe that Florida might be within reach and that means Kerry just needs that and NJ and every state it says he's currently leading in. I could see Bush winning the popular vote this time around but Kerry winning the electoral college (with 20 or 21 states i might add). Virginia looks like it could be key too, I've read elsewhere that Virginia actually seems to be drifting to the blue side.

[HBox]

<img src="http://www.electoral-vote.com/states/florida.png" width=600 height=280>

Florida's not looking very good recently. I guess I should mention that the only pollster to get 2000 right was Zogby, and his polls have shown Kerry doing better than in the rest of the polls, so who knows? We'll see November 2.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 10-15-04 @ 3:11 AM

[GodsFavoriteMan]

There's also the problem that polls like Gallup have of screening voters to "likely voters." That tends to lower Kerry's score.

Also, Kerry "lost" FL by 500-some votes. There's a population of approx 78,000 people of Arabic descent-safe bet the majority are Muslim- and in droves they voted for Bush in 2000. This year they've switched sides. If that's the case, and assuming that Florida is statistically the same as in 2000, Kerry should win.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/goodluvin_copy.jpg">

This message was edited by GodsFavoriteMan on 10-15-04 @ 3:24 AM

[TheMojoPin]

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. President George W. Bush opened a four-point lead on Democratic Sen. John Kerry the day after the final debate between the White House rivals, according to a Reuters/Zogby poll released on Friday. (http://cnn.aimtoday.cnn.com/news/story.jsp?maxphotos=5&phototerm=Bush&idq=/ff/story/0002/20041015/0714962014.htm&photoid=20041014ORRB107)

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Reephdweller]

CNN/USAT/Gallup (788 LV) 10/14 - 10/16 52% 44% 1% Bush +8

In almost all of the polls (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/bush_vs_kerry.html) Bush has pulled ahead of Kerry. The same is showing on the Polling Report. (http://www.pollingreport.com/) I guess Bush somehow did better than Kerry in the debates overall. I didn't think Bush did better, but yet somehow he's pulled ahead.

I'm not a believer in polls, though it is something to consider when you want to see how the candidtates did in the debates.



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[TheMojoPin]

I think it's the opposite.

Kerry's a complete non-entity zero, so when he doesn't get big "event" exposure like the debates, he loses any momentum he has. I think he won the debates, and the polls reflected that...but as soon as they were over, his train came gridning to a hault, and Bush pulled back into the lead. Looking at the site you linked to, Bush's lead looks to be more like 3-4 points if you pull from the more reliable polls, as opposed to 8, but that's still a significant lead.

I've yet to actually see anything that indidcates Kerry could possibly win between now and Novemeber. If he somehow manages to become president, I'll be shocked beyond belief. He had to win HUGE in the debates, and he didn't. Those were his last big shots at taking this away from Bush.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 10-17-04 @ 1:43 PM

[HBox]

I think what that shows is that the deabtes meant little. In some of the polls that show Bush ahead respondents still said Kerry won the debates. All the debates did apparently was establsih Kerry as a credible candidate when he was in danger of losing for good.

And a reason to be skeptical of those polls is that they are of "likely voters." Every pollster uses different criteria for that, and Gallup in particular has been showing much more Republicans in their likely voter numbers despite that more registered Democrats voted in 2000. But maybe they'll be right, who knows? The only poll that counts is on Nov. 2.

P.S. And don't get to hung up on national polls. We learned in 2000 how much the popular vote means. Zilch.

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

This message was edited by HBox on 10-17-04 @ 1:47 PM

[Reephdweller]

P.S. And don't get to hung up on national polls. We learned in 2000 how much the popular vote means. Zilch.


I agree, I don't put a whole lot into them, but I do look at them out of curiousity.

I also agree with Mojo, though I just don't know what it is if it's something that Kerry is doing that is wrong or something that Bush is doing right that seems to have shifted the polls back towards Bush.

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[GodsFavoriteMan]

I wouldn't be so dead set in believing that Bush is surging. From the polls in Electoral-Vote (http://www.electoral-vote.com) we see that Florida is now a statistical tie (it had been Bush up by 5-8 points for the past couple months) Ohio has been back and forth between barely Bush and barely Kerry, and just last week, after the third debate, Bush had the advantage over Kerry.

I'm not saying Kerry is gaining so much momentum that he will win, but certainly, if he does, it shouldn't be much of a surprise to anyone following polls. Right now, it's such a dead heat, I wouldn't be surprised by either one being the winner. Or even a repeat of the 2000 elections.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/goodluvin_copy.jpg">

[Yerdaddy]

Bush will come in a distant 3rd to Kerry and Nader according to this scienteriffic<a href="http://www.ronfez.net/messageboard/viewmessages.cfm/Forum/87/Topic/41683/page/Who_would_you_vote_for_.htm" target="_blank"> poll</a>

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=bonedaddy5">
Fuck it from behind.

[LiquidCourage]

Ever since joining the Marine Corps I've had this radical political overhaul. If Bush wins this election, after Pearl Harbor and Sept. 11th, I'll call it the worst day in the history of this country.

[HBox]

Would you say this is a widespread phenomenon in the military right now or was this more of a personal thing?

http://www.myimgs.com/random/hbox/sig

[LiquidCourage]

This was more of a personal thing. I can't tell you how much being stationed in "the Bible belt" changed my views of this country.

I think most military just votes for who will give them a pay raise. Somehow this rumor started up that "Kerry wants to cut our pay by 10%." I would never believe it, for at least the reason that Kerry knows it would kill him to openly support slashing pay by that much. I've never heard of this in any news sources, it's just sort of that "through the grapevine" kind of gossip. I never believe things when I hear about them like that.

[LiquidCourage]

However, even if it turned out to be true that Kerry was going to slash military pay by 10%, I'd probably still vote for him anyway. I'd "take one for the team". That's how badly I think the Bush administration is hurting this country.

[TheMojoPin]

Hey, with Bush cutting out veterans benefits, I guess it's more a question of what's better off...being fucked now, or being fucked down the line.

<img src="http://scripts.cgispy.com/image.cgi?u=TheMojoPin">
1979 << I love my drug buddy... >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[GodsFavoriteMan]

However, even if it turned out to be true that Kerry was going to slash military pay by 10%, I'd probably still vote for him anyway. I'd "take one for the team". That's how badly I think the Bush administration is hurting this country.



Hate to say it, but I think you're giving the troops too much credit. When I was in, Clinton gave us the largest single pay raise since the Carter admin. The ones there who hated Clinton for simply being Clinton and being a Democrat still hated him. No one even acknowledged the pay raise. Pluse there's no way in hell Kerry, or anyone, would cut soldiers pay by 10%. And finally, historically, soldiers pay and benefits increase during democratic presidential admins, whereas overall defense spending increases during Republican. But, who cares about thoses stats? Not many I served with.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/goodluvin_copy.jpg">

[BooBooKittyFuck]

I personally do not want Kerry to win, but if Bush wins then in 2008 Hillary will most likely run so either way we're screwed.

http://www.oddworldz.com/ravvy/jay_and_silent_bob.jpg

[Reephdweller]

I think we have been screwed for at least the last 16 years, and will definitely be for the next 12.

I am not trying to bash Kerry or anything but I honestly do not think that there will be anything better with him in office. Not that Bush has been so fantastic. If the poll numbers are accurate and Bush ends up winning somehow, I think it will come down to the fact that people saw two people that are really going to give them more of the same thing and that if they have to go down that route then they'd rather go with someone they know.

I also think that Kerry making statements about social security, and the draft are tired arguments that people see through these days. I think that the days of scare tactics to intimidate people to vote one way or another are over for a while.

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[GodsFavoriteMan]

How were we screwed during the Clinton administration? Bad news was at such a minimum that Republicans had to focus on a blow job.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/goodluvin_copy.jpg">

This message was edited by GodsFavoriteMan on 10-18-04 @ 9:08 AM

[Reephdweller]

How were we screwed during the Clinton administration?


I'm not pointing to any specific administration, and this is only one specific point. However when over 2,000 Americans die at the hands of terrorists and then we look at things like the 9/11 report and see the mistakes made I can't help but be jaded. Like I said, I'm not blaming Clinton, or anyone. But I do believe that cuts in intelligence, military, etc ultimately hurt us.

I think it's horrible and I know that this has been discussed before, but I think the treatment of veterans by administratitions going back before even Reagan is atrocious. I think our political leaders on both sides have let us down in terms of working towards education, industry, jobs, etc.

Like I said, and I'll say it again before someone says I'm blaming one person of another, I think these two parties have worked very hard over the last 16 or even more years to do very little for us.

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[curtoid]

However, even if it turned out to be true that Kerry was going to slash military pay by 10%, I'd probably still vote for him anyway. I'd "take one for the team". That's how badly I think the Bush administration is hurting this country.

The thing I'd like to know, from the neo-cons and fearmongers out there, is how exactly is Kerry supposed to push through his scary LIBERAL agenda with the house and senate acting as a perfect balance?



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/curtoid/22.jpg
"One of our normal friends." - RB

[LiquidCourage]

How were we screwed during the Clinton administration? Bad news was at such a minimum that Republicans had to focus on a blow job.

<img src="http://home.comcast.net/~stan_ferguson/goodluvin_copy.jpg">

This message was edited by GodsFavoriteMan on 10-18-04 @ 9:08 AM


Unfortunately I realized this way to late in the game.