America Appreciation Thread

[ChickenHawk]

Let's not make this a political thread, because it's not, and there's already plenty of those as it is. I just wanna tell everyone to take a step back today and realize how privileged you are to live in this great nation. I don't wanna sound like a preachy flag-waver here, but it really just hit me again today when I was at the Yankee game. I was at Old-Timers Day, where many Yankee greats came out to be commemorated and appreciated for the great times they brought to their fans. And looking around, while the fans thanked the players, I realized how great it is that we can even DO this... There are places in the world where this doesn't happen. There are people in the world who will never experience such moments of enjoyment. ...That, while things are far from perfect here, there's a hell of a lot to appreciate. Things that those who are truly suffering would consider merely trivial.
I'm definitely not amongst the wealthy in this country, but I'm not amongst the poor either. But no matter how poor you are in this country, it truly is a land of opportunity. Everyone has the OPTION to pick themselves up by the bootstraps and at least GET BY.
I only get out to one or two Yankee games a year because it certainly isn't a cheap day at the ballpark. But looking at the shit that goes on in this world, I realize that I truly am rich. The fact that my biggest complaint today was that the bleacher seats made my back ache is something that makes me extraordinarily grateful. I can have a cold, clean glass of water WHEN I WANT IT. ...Sounds crazy, but that isn't a reality for everyone in the world.
Seeing the many immigrant baseball players during the singing of the national anthem, who came to this country to pursue their dreams, made me truly proud that they were able to come here and do so. The fact that I could come out and enjoy a great day of baseball with thousands of awesome fans made me just step back and think where I COULD be in the world. And yes, there are other free nations where the lifestyle is almost identical to that of America. So I'm not gonna say America is the only great nation in the world, but there's also a hell of a lot of places in the world like THIS:

<IMG SRC="http://www.awitness.org/news/september_2001/graphics/poverty.jpg">

I'm glad I live in a place where the freedom to enjoy simple pleasures like baseball is available and too often taken for granted.

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This message was edited by ChickenHawk on 7-11-04 @ 1:25 AM

[fluffernutter]

Not trying to make light but I thought of something like this earlier (and now with the replay) as I am watching Rocky. The whole thing about Apollo giving the average joe the opportunity to fight him because America is the Land of Opportunity. Just throwing in my two cents here. I don't wanna get too nutty.

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[SatCam]

I'm priveleged to be controlled by a corrupt government, yes!

Thank you founding fathers!

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[whoopsy]

well said, hawk, rare to get those moments of clarity. I'm typically too busy bitching about my job to see the big picture. Thought I knew what poor was till I did some travelling, then i just shut my mouth..

- whoopsy -

[sr71blackbird]

I think a LOT of people do not realise what we have here and they think it sucks here and stuff, but I know what we have is awesome. Most immigrant people I know really cannot believe it when they hear some people bitch about this place. Even the shittiest neighborhood has potential for success here. We all have access to greatness and it is entirely dependant on your desire to acheive it and the effort you put into it. We are VERY lucky. Most of the freedoms we have is because of the military assuring it for us , and for them we should be very appreciative.

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[SatCam]

Honestly, if I had to choose to live anywhere in the world, my choice would definatly be America, but I feel like America is so overrated. Freedom is limited and although, compared to 90% of the other counties out there, we actually HAVE freedoms, I feel like we should have more and an average human being should be given the right to live under their own rules, not the rules of someone from Massechussettes or Texas.

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[Se7en]

I'm priveleged to be controlled by a corrupt government, yes!

Thank you founding fathers!


Wow - the man asked that the thread not get political, and it took only to the third post (counting the one that started the thread) to do just that.

Must be a new record.

On the bright side, SatCam, since you criticized America, these days that makes you a superpatriot.

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[reeshy]

I'm priveleged to be controlled by a corrupt government, yes!


Fuck you, SatCam. You're nothing but a little privileged punk-ass bitch kid who runs to mommy and daddy when something goes wrong!!! I used to like you but that last comment of your's got to me and now I see what you're really all about!!!! Stay out of my threads!!!!!!!!

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[reeshy]

And thank you, Chickenhawk!!!!

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[SatCam]

Wow - the man asked that the thread not get political, and it took only to the third post (counting the one that started the thread) to do just that.

Hey, I was speaking about the government *in general*. This whole country's freedoms are based around the government and I was not getting political (unless you consider mentioning the founding fathers getting political).
And if you're wondering, what I said had NOTHING to do with the current administration.

But I can see my pussy-ass punk bitch tits are not welcome in this thread, so commence with your comments.

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[skullcrush]

i chew-chew-chews...AMERICA!!!

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[Tall_James]

"Ventura Highway" rocks!!!

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[TheMojoPin]

Our porn set the standard, goddammit. Japan and Europe may be freakier...BUT WE WERE FIRST.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Mike Teacher]

This whole country's freedoms are based around the government


I would hope not; Then it's really not free.

But then again, it isn't. For all the talk of our personal freedoms, I see less about our personal responsibilities; and these are based not on the government, but by us.

Q: What are the moral responibilities of the American citizen?

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[TheMojoPin]

Q: What are the moral responibilities of the American citizen?

"Don't do shit unless."

"Unless what?"

"Unless YOU do it first."

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[ChickenHawk]

I'm priveleged to be controlled by a corrupt government, yes!
Controlled? If it's nice out tomorrow, go to the park and have a picnic. See if anyone stops you.
You actually have no idea what it's like to be CONTROLLED by a government.

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This message was edited by ChickenHawk on 7-12-04 @ 6:41 PM

[SatCam]

Yes I do!!!!!
I can't have sex with an older man (or woman)!

But please, carry on!

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[ChickenHawk]

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[Mike Teacher]

Well done ChickenHawk!

I was hinting at several things, the most obvious is the 'Social Contract'. Some here and elsewhere have said we should be able to do what we want, when we want. Well, thats great until you meet someone who feels like kid touching or robbing banks or punching people randomly in the street. The social contract says, ok; I have rights, up to a point, where they start to infringe on others.

[Where's the lawyers around here I'm doing this from the stoned-out memories of my old college classes?]

See; really, the government doesnt give us freedom, it isnt theres to give. They cant control each and every one of us, so we agree to behave within certain parameters in society, not coz the Gov or Army or Police say so; just coz its the Right Thing to do.

Which begs the next Q:

Without a God, where does one find a Moral Code of Conduct?

God I'm annoying.

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[canofsoup15]

Without a God, where does one find a Moral Code of Conduct?


Mike, I have been questioning this myself lately. I think that morals are found from experiences, experiences with other people, and experiences with onself. Family has a big part to play in a persons morality for basic humane things that everyone pretty much follows (killing other people for instance is seen as immoral). However when it comes to the specifics of morals (for instance sexual things like premarital sex, age of consent, etc.) I believe that a person must make them for himself depending on his own belief structure which was given to that person by their family.

Either it's that, or I'm completely wrong. Morals are a hard topic to discuss.

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This message was edited by canofsoup15 on 7-12-04 @ 8:06 PM

[HBox]

Without a God, where does one find a Moral Code of Conduct?

I don't need a fake or real deity to recognize right from wrong. All I need is empathy.

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[TheMojoPin]

You actually have no idea what it's like to be CONTROLLED by a government.

To be fair, neither do you. I think a lot of people have really bizarre and severe opinions of how "free" many other countries are in the rest of the world. We're at the top of the heap of a lot of things, and that's great, but implying that it's somehow lucky we can just go to a park and have a picnic is a bit extreme and alarmist. I've lived around the world, and with the exception of Panama (Where I simply WOULDN'T have wanted to do it, since this was right before Noreaga was taken down), I could easily have done what you're talking about any time I felt like it.

I mean, I "get" what you're saying, but there are far more signifcant and almost exclusive "benefits" that we are very fortunate to have just by being citizens here. I simply think it's very belittling to throw something like that at SatCam (And actually pretty belittling to the original point of this thread) over what he said.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[ChickenHawk]

To be fair, neither do you.
That's why I never said I did.

I think a lot of people have really bizarre and severe opinions of how "free" many other countries are in the rest of the world. We're at the top of the heap of a lot of things, and that's great, but implying that it's somehow lucky we can just go to a park and have a picnic is a bit extreme and alarmist. I've lived around the world, and with the exception of Panama (Where I simply WOULDN'T have wanted to do it, since this was right before Noreaga was taken down), I could easily have done what you're talking about any time I felt like it.
Dude, you gotta start reading my entire posts. I'm aware that freedom is not exclusive to America, which is why I specifically stated that America is not the only great place in the world and that there are many places with nearly identical freedoms and opportunities.

I simply think it's very belittling to throw something like that at SatCam (And actually pretty belittling to the original point of this thread) over what he said.
No.
No, because I kindly requested that it not turn into a political thread, and that was overtly disregarded.

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This message was edited by ChickenHawk on 7-12-04 @ 8:51 PM

[SatCam]

CH, please start an America Depreciation Thread to divert the madness from here. Thanks xoxoxoxox

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[TheMojoPin]

Dude, you gotta start reading my entire posts.

I did. I responded to this one.

Controlled? If it's nice out tomorrow, go to the park and have a picnic. See if anyone stops you.
You actually have no idea what it's like to be CONTROLLED by a government.

What did I miss? That was the entire thing. I wasn't responding to another post, I was replying to THAT one.

I don't disagree with you at all...I just think it was an absolutely unecessary thing to say. So SatCam said something you don't like...take the higher ground and ignore it. It only becomes a political DISCUSSION when people are responding to each other. I only brought it up because it seemed like you were disregarding your own request because of one tiny comment somebody said that didn't need to be replied to in the first place.

Besides, the thing I'm most impressed with in this country IS how our government works on ALL levels, from the local counties and cities up to the federal level. That's an inherrently "political" statement. Our country's freedoms are based specifically around the type of government and politics that were designed for us over two centuries ago. It was inevitable that somebody was going to bring something up based along those lines. So what?

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 7-12-04 @ 9:13 PM

[ChickenHawk]

Although it may look like one, this is not a reply to your last post.

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[TheMojoPin]

He, it's your freedom to be a sissypants.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[ChickenHawk]

What was that you said about "taking the higher ground"?

Alright, i'm done here for a while, cuz this thread is turning into an AIM conversation. I'm gonna go watch the Home Run Derby.

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[TheMojoPin]

Do as I say, not as I do. I'm the worst example for EVERYTHING. That's a good general mantra to go by.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Mike Teacher]

Mike, I have been questioning this myself lately. I think that morals are found from experiences, experiences with other people, and experiences with onself. Family has a big part to play in a persons morality for basic humane things that everyone pretty much follows (killing other people for instance is seen as immoral). However when it comes to the specifics of morals (for instance sexual things like premarital sex, age of consent, etc.) I believe that a person must make them for himself depending on his own belief structure which was given to that person by their family.


And yer right, it's a tough one to discuss.

Check out Michael Shermer's new book;

The Science of Good and Evil: Why People Cheat, Gossip, Care, Share, and Follow the Golden Rule.

Even if you dont buy it, the Amazon site has his thesis pretty much summed up, well, i'll sum it up; he says we are Moral because it is in our Nature due mostly to evolution staregies like altruism, sharing, cooperation....


Linky Linkerton (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0805075208/qid=1089676429/sr=2-2/ref=sr_2_2/103-7476057-7089408)

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This message was edited by Mike Teacher on 7-12-04 @ 9:18 PM

[fluffernutter]

So i am at the Phillies game yesterday and it is time for the national anthem. I take off my hat and look over at the flag but suddenly my focus turns to the Video Screen with the beautiful young lady singing the anthem and full D-cup cleavage just all over the place.

I stood at attention and proclaimed God Bless America!

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[TheMojoPin]

I can't stand people who don't take their hats off at games when the Anthem is playing. Wise the fuck up, jerk-offs.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

[Se7en]

Do as I say, not as I do. I'm the worst example for EVERYTHING. That's a good general mantra to go by.

Can I remember that next time you call me a hypocrite?

Perhaps I shall.

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[TheMojoPin]

Why, so we can be hypocrites together? MY failings don't somehow give YOU a free pass.

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1979 << December boys got it BAD >> "You can tell some lies about the good times we've had, but I've kissed your mother twice...and now I'm working on your dad..."

This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 7-13-04 @ 5:37 AM

[fluffernutter]

I can't stand people who don't take their hats off at games when the Anthem is playing. Wise the fuck up, jerk-offs.


I was so guilty of this last year at a Demolition Derby in Buck, PA. Not exactly the place I would want to "forget" to take off my hat. I was a bit not proud of being an American at the time cause I was just so disgusted with the War and Bush and if anything I was a bit ashamed. My mind was a bit clouded too and looking back on it, it was quite the big mistake and no matter how I feel at any time about the state of our country or government, I need to RESPECT those who did DIE and SACRIFICE themselves for my country over our history and for that alone show that honor to the flag during the anthem. Also, having two or three redneck say "Buddy! Take off your hat!" scared me quite a bit.

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[FUNKMAN]

I can understand what you are trying to say i just feel that a Yankee game is one of the poorest examples of freedom. Maybe in the early days of baseball when the average fan didn't get raped for tickets, a hot dog or a beer. A Yankee game has become the 'shining exapmle' of what's wrong in America. I honestly feel people are brainwashed into thinking they've got it 'pretty good' when they're working two jobs but they got a big screen tv. At the end of their lives their bodies will be worn down and at 60 they will have the body of an 80 year old. Employers are raising the "numbers' for retirement all across the country and eventually the average working person will have to work til he's 70 years old before being able to retire with medical coverage.

The idea that 'there is opportunity for everyone' is absolutely false. There are 6 million people out of work. Opportunity? to constantly have your benefits cut, to work longer hours, to have your employment move overseas because the stock price needs to be maintained, even though companies are still making good profits.

I just wish for one or two years every fan would refuse to attend a pro sports event, or refuse to watch tv, go to a movie, or buy a dvd or cd, just one or two years out of your life. If it did happen i bet you can agree that there would be a major change. in how the fan is considered by the millionaires and the billionaires...

things have just gotten way out of whack...






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