Mike Teacher
03-22-2004, 05:10 AM
Ok This is straddling overlapping with the Passion threads, and I include it here for that reason, but feel free to move. It's about the link really, which is 95% about the Data on Jesus and 5% about the movie.
An Excellent article in the new Skeptic magazine, it takes a real 'what's the data' on this approach to the Question:
Who Really Killed Jesus? (http://www.skeptic.com/PassionOfChrist.html)
EDIT: It's a Lengthy piece. So a Taster here: and thanx again Mods; the movie is huge, but I don't feel people have had a chance to hear this side of the story:
From Mike Shermer:
If Jesus did not die for our sins then there is no point in being a Christian--one might as well be a Jew (no religious belief is also acceptable).
If Jesus did die for our sins--indeed, if he HAD to die for our sins as we are told he did in order for us to be saved, or born again--then why must ANYONE be blamed, let alone condemned?
If this was a foreordained event by God, then it was out of human hands. If it was not predetermined by God and was instead a contingent event that might or might not have happened, shouldn't we be thanking the Jews (or the Romans) for doing an unpleasant but necessary deed?
After all, thanks to the crucifixion and the resurrection, all who accept it are born again, saved, and will have everlasting life. Shouldn't Pilate, Barabbas, Ciaphas, and the mob all get special dispensation from God?
And the article concludes:
In summation, the trial before Ciaphas, the Barabbas episode, the reluctance of Pilate to condemn Jesus, and the Jewish mob demanding his death are, like every other aspect of the Passion and Resurrection narratives, pure fiction.
This message was edited by Mike Teacher on 3-22-04 @ 9:24 AM
An Excellent article in the new Skeptic magazine, it takes a real 'what's the data' on this approach to the Question:
Who Really Killed Jesus? (http://www.skeptic.com/PassionOfChrist.html)
EDIT: It's a Lengthy piece. So a Taster here: and thanx again Mods; the movie is huge, but I don't feel people have had a chance to hear this side of the story:
From Mike Shermer:
If Jesus did not die for our sins then there is no point in being a Christian--one might as well be a Jew (no religious belief is also acceptable).
If Jesus did die for our sins--indeed, if he HAD to die for our sins as we are told he did in order for us to be saved, or born again--then why must ANYONE be blamed, let alone condemned?
If this was a foreordained event by God, then it was out of human hands. If it was not predetermined by God and was instead a contingent event that might or might not have happened, shouldn't we be thanking the Jews (or the Romans) for doing an unpleasant but necessary deed?
After all, thanks to the crucifixion and the resurrection, all who accept it are born again, saved, and will have everlasting life. Shouldn't Pilate, Barabbas, Ciaphas, and the mob all get special dispensation from God?
And the article concludes:
In summation, the trial before Ciaphas, the Barabbas episode, the reluctance of Pilate to condemn Jesus, and the Jewish mob demanding his death are, like every other aspect of the Passion and Resurrection narratives, pure fiction.
This message was edited by Mike Teacher on 3-22-04 @ 9:24 AM