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furie
09-02-2003, 04:14 PM
How's the water in your hometown? Is it good anywhere? I remember a time when I drank from the hose with confidance. Now I have a filter installed in my place. What happened?


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Mike Teacher
09-02-2003, 04:17 PM
What happened?


The quick answer is: the Industrial Revolution.



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sr71blackbird
09-02-2003, 04:23 PM
I boil my tap water and when it cools, I filter it through a Britta before I drink it. Long Islands water is full of pesticide, DDT, and all kinds of deposits and carcinogens. In the 20's, they had huge potatoe farms across the sandy soil of the island and all that crap is now in the aquifers. Of course, its probably better than water in Calcutta. What I do sometimes is take a teflon frying pan and boil a cup of water in it until it evapoartes and see all the shit thats in the water left on the pan (mostly calcium I hope!).


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Heather 8
09-02-2003, 04:30 PM
My tap water has a distinctive taste and odor of the three paper mills located in my city. I haven't drunk tap water in over 10 years, and I even prepare my foods with bottled water.

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Hottub
09-02-2003, 04:38 PM
I have been drinking the Hackensack Water/United Water since I was an infant.

I love the smell of chlorine in the morning. It smell like...a swimming pool.

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Death Metal Moe
09-02-2003, 04:45 PM
I drink mine in the summer, if I really need a drink badly. But if I can wait, I usually wait for my water to filter through the Brita jug thing on our counter. And that gets annoying trying to make a 2 quart pitcher of pink lemonade.

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PanterA
09-02-2003, 04:46 PM
Flushing Queens tap tastes better then bottled water. I drink it everyday. mmmmm.

-- BTW, the first person to quote "I drink it, everyday." and says "That explains it" is a hack poster!

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This message was edited by PanterA on 9-2-03 @ 8:47 PM

Mike Teacher
09-02-2003, 05:03 PM
What Happened to the Water?

The short answer is: The Industrial Revolution.
The long answer is: A course in the history of Water Chemistry. After Chem 1+2, Organic, a few others.
Or, a Library Card.

Here's an in-between answer;

Less then 50 years ago the idea that water on the earth might get rare, or even scarce, was deemed absurd but many, including a good chuck of the Scientific Community.

Hey, well just look around! I mean, it's everywhere. Lakes, streams, rainfall. run out? How? Well, while we were rejoicing water's uses we were reproducing. During Johnny Carson's tenure on the Tonight Show, the population of the earth Doubled. Too many people in a given place, and the amount of Clean, Fresh, potable water decreases, and then disappears, leaving water fouled by the wates of humans, bodily, and the garbage we throw out. The garbage, itself, wasn't necessarily harmful, but they could allow the water to become filled with aerobic, and then anaerobic bacteria [think Methane, Hydrogen Sulfide [the stuff in stink bombs], and Ammonia]. And we share the planet with other animals, and eat them, and breed them, and they make waste too. This is the Centuries Old problem.

Alonside these events, the Industrial Revolution, which was, in part, the Revolution in Chemistry, specifically in manufacturing. And the New Problem.

We got good. At inventing things. Real good. All the Technology of the past Century alone, the Chemists had their Golden Age and just invented all of the coolest stuff in the world; the World of Chemistry. Nylon, plastics, big steel, clothing, Kevlar, Chem-Lawn, Semtex, MDMA, Cell Phones, Computers, artificial hearts, Pharmaceuticals, paints, nuclear power, tampons, High Fructose Corn Syrup and Partially Hydrogenated Palm and/or Vegetable Oil [you eat gobs of both of the former every day, not the tampons.], Pesticides, lasers, TV, Radio, and of course, Cherry Flavored Pez. We literally transformed the world around us, from huts to Condos, from Hunting Game to Meat Sections, from Cotton to, Micromesh and Spandex. And it all rocked, and made things easy, and cool, and fun.

But there was a problem. Big Time. Some of the chemicals we made, and used, and invented, were found out to be harmful. Some we knew about; some we never saw coming. But we found out some chemicals were toxic. Some were insidious, harmless when ingested, but harmful if allowed to build up in the body over time. Others caused caners; Carcinogens. Some caused genetic mutations; Mutagens. Some, like Mercury and Thalidomide, seemed ok for adults, but were horrifically harmful to a developing fetus; Teratogens. And some were harmful in quantities so small as to be next to nothing.

Take your everyday paper clip. It weighs about one gram. Imagine dividing that paper clip into one million pieces; 1,000,000. A millionth of a gram is 1 Microgram. If that's tough to imagine, take the paper clip and cut it into 1,000 pieces, and then ONE of those bits, and cut IT into 1,000 pieces. The invisible speck you would have would have a mass of a Microgram, and there are substances that are toxic, or carcinogenic, at quantities that small. No Way? Way. Think about taking 10mg of Valium, and how that affects a body. 10mg is just 10 of the pieces you cut above, when you cut the paper clip into 1,000 pieces. 10mg of some substances will Dr0p a human like a bullet to the medulla.

Toxins, Carcinogens, Teratogens, Mutagens, Radioactivity [there's a radioactive substance used in just about every single Smoke Detector made today, for example], we had all us this happening around us, and hence to us.

Bad water isn't new. 400 Years ago the Deaths in London from the horrific pollution in the Thames were well documented. That's simply too many people using the water, which is the other big problem today.

Blame? Ethics? I just teach the science, so for now, there you go.


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UnknownPD
09-02-2003, 05:07 PM
I boil my tap water and when it cools, I filter it through a Britta before I drink it. Long Islands water is full of pesticide, DDT, and all kinds of deposits and carcinogens.

Seems like an awful lot to go through to add a couple of years to your life. Maybe you'll get three extra years, but spend five years worth of time doing it. We are all gonna die anyway. Why stress about it?

SatCam
09-02-2003, 05:20 PM
I have my own well. If you pour chemicals into the ground, you gotta drink em.

If you look at the well in my basement, I've seen poland spring jugs of water bigger than this pewny piece of shit.

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sr71blackbird
09-02-2003, 05:23 PM
Seems like an awful lot to go through to add a couple of years to your life.



I hear you, its just something Ive been doing since reading stuff like Teach's information above. I just dont wanna die before I need to. Please dont take anything Mike or I say as so literal that you stop enjoying your life. Theres nothing we can do about this stuff, and we really dont want to enforce legislation that will ensure this too. Price Willam sound today is as pristine as it was the day before the Valdez sank and our efforts had absolutely nothing to do with it. Nature balances itself for the most part. DNA is an exraordinarily tuff molecule and nothing we can do can change it in its entirety. I hope no one takes our diatribes too seriously. Environmantal changes are what enables species to evolve, and are a uselful and moral aspect to the preservation of all species. The strong survive and no matter what, something will live and reproduce and within a million years, repopulate the planet with diversity should we fall.


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Fallon
09-02-2003, 06:06 PM
I like tap water. I'm drinking it as I type.

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Arienette
09-02-2003, 06:18 PM
the tap water in the bronx is eh... there's worse around, but i dont drink it. i do cook with it, though. it's bottled water for me

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This message was edited by Arienette on 9-2-03 @ 10:21 PM

carguy
09-02-2003, 06:27 PM
The water in my area sucks. It tastes awful and it isn't exactly clear. I put in one of those water filters with it's own faucet. The filter is supposed to be good for six months or 600 gallons. I'm lucky if I get a month out of it before the water flow becomes just a drip.

SuperClerk
09-02-2003, 06:35 PM
I have no complaints aboot Brooklyn tap water. It's always tasted very good to me. I usually always have a glass in each of my 3 hands.

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Death Metal Moe
09-02-2003, 06:44 PM
Seems like an awful lot to go through to add a couple of years to your life. Maybe you'll get three extra years, but spend five years worth of time doing it. We are all gonna die anyway. Why stress about it?


I gotta agree with UnknownPD on this one. Not just for this topic, but life in general. There is no rhyme or reason to life. Children get cancer as people who smoke and drink live into their 90's. You will shave more time off your life worrying about everything you expose your body to than add time to your lifespan protecting yourself from any and all threats. Should you try to be careful, of course. But drink your tap water and chill out. Eat a pound of bacon on your way to Rutt's Hut, order 5 Rippers and wash them down with some beer. It's quality of life, not quantity.

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sr71blackbird
09-02-2003, 06:56 PM
I'm lucky if I get a month out of it before the water flow becomes just a drip.



Its likely that sedement is building behind the screen before it reaches the filter. Everyone should periodically unscrew theur aerator on their tap and see all the crap (rust, scale) thats built up behind it and then run thier tap several minutes to clear away the sedement. Youll be suprised. City water (NY) is typically far cleaner than suburban water. City water comes from upstate where its more pristine. NY City regularly wins taste tests, as it should, sice there is little difference between NY's tap water and Poland Spring. LI's water comes from underground aquifers that get its quality through filtration through the sedementary action of rain moving through sandy soil. Impurities make their way easily into aquifers though the sand, because sand isnt that great of a filter and municipalities are not remotely in the business of maintaining water quality. The water we have here on Long Island is fair compared to industrial standards and far higher than most 3rd world countrys. The breast cancer rates here are part and parcel with the additives that farmers used during the 20's to assure bumper crops of potatoes and other crops (corn). Like I said, I boil it and then filter it. Im sure if I boiled down my filtered water in a teflon pan though, Id still find impurities. Im just trying to minimize my exposure.


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Mike Teacher
09-02-2003, 06:59 PM
Please dont take anything Mike or I say as so literal that you stop enjoying your life. Theres nothing we can do about this stuff, and we really dont want to enforce legislation that will ensure this too. Price Willam sound today is as pristine as it was the day before the Valdez sank and our efforts had absolutely nothing to do with it. Nature balances itself for the most part. DNA is an exraordinarily tuff molecule and nothing we can do can change it in its entirety.


Agreed and agreed.

Some will live the clean life and get cancer at 30. Or even 3.

Some will smoke 3 packs a day and die of trick knee at 93.

And if it came across like I think we're destroying the planet, I'm not on that kick either. Mother Nature reminds us all the time who the real boss is.

But a lot of this is indeed preventable. Premature death, I mean. Smoking and Obesity for starters. Again, there are no hard-fast rules, but this nation is in Shockingly Bad Shape.

Uh Oh...Another topic...

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ADF
09-02-2003, 07:06 PM
Some, like Mercury and Thalidomide, seemed ok for adults, but were horrifically harmful to a developing fetus


Mercury is ok for adults? Great, now I feel a lot better about that Make Your Own Fur Hats at Home thing I started.

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TheMojoPin
09-02-2003, 08:52 PM
I guess the Northern VA water is OK. I have a water filter in the fridge, but I grab a glass of tap water out of my bedroom's bathroom several times a day and it tastes fine. It tastes fine. Fine it tastes. Tastes fine it. FINE FINE. Taste TASTE FINe IT IT IT FINE TASTE TASTE THE TASTE FINE!!!

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This message was edited by TheMojoPin on 9-3-03 @ 1:06 AM

mdr55
09-02-2003, 08:58 PM
Wouldn't it be funny if the companies like Deer Park, Polar Spring, etc......got their water from the sink. And all we're paying for is the belief that the water is pure and mostly unadulterated.

And where does the no-frills water come from anyway that they sell in the supermarket?

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TheMojoPin
09-02-2003, 09:07 PM
And where does the no-frills water come from anyway that they sell in the supermarket?

Milsford.

NOT Dunbee.

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dassal3399
09-02-2003, 10:32 PM
NYC tap water, do I need to say more!

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sr71blackbird
09-03-2003, 02:41 AM
I was getting gas on Sunday, and I went inside to pay and grabbed a 16 oz bottle of Poland Spring water from the rack, and the guy is being apoligetic for the gas being close to $2 a gallon and I realise, I just paid $1.25 for 16 oz. of water! I'll move far more on a gallon of gas then 16 oz. of water will take me! Oz. for oz. gas is still, regardless of price, the cheapest liquid we can buy!




Its like drinking Drano. Sure it will clean you out, but it will leave you hollow inside.






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Mike Teacher
09-03-2003, 04:43 AM
Mercury is ok for adults?


In a way, yes; in that all of us, every single one, is walking around with mercury, lead, cadmium, and other heavy metals [go for it, Moe!] stored up in us.

What are the effects on adult humans for this? Methyle Mercury poisoning is seen in adults, but the concentration needed to harm a developing fetus is much much smaller.

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guttersnipe
09-03-2003, 04:45 AM
Seems like everywhere I've lived in the past few years, something's been wrong with the water. In Smithfield, VA (yeah, the ham place) the water was way too soft and I felt like I could never get all the soap off my body. And I wouldn't drink it just out of fear of what the pig plant might be doing to the water. There was some kind of polluted water lawsuit going on with the plant around the time we moved.

In Chesapeake, VA, the water smelled really funny, so I didn't drink it. Then, while I was pregnant with my daughter, it hit the headlines that women were miscarrying all over the city due to some chemical in the water. Thank god I was drinking and cooking with Evian already. But that made me scared to even take a shower in that crap.

Then we built a house outside of Fredericksburg, VA. We had well water that had so much iron/rust in it that my blonde hair turned orange. (that's why I dye my hair auburn these days.) NO WAY was I drinking THAT stuff.

Now I'm in Fairfax County VA. The water tastes okay, I feel rinsed clean after a shower, and no one's hair is turning orange. But I'm still scared of it and still drink and cook with bottled water.

Mike the Teacher, I do appreaciate you sharing your knowledge with us, I really do. But damn, it's no wonder I can't sleep at night.

~snipe




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Mike Teacher
09-03-2003, 05:01 AM
Emotional, perhaps disturbing Photo below, maybe not on the scale of your world, but i feel a need to say this here... [like yer not gonna glance down] ...sorry...


Did you know they give out Pulitzer Prizes for photography? Every once in a while a photograph is taken that evokes a Huge reaction; an outcry, positive or negative...

the girl running naked after a napalm hit in viet Name...

...Jack Ruby shooting Lee Harvey Oswald

...The Wright Bros at Kitty Hawk and Buzz Standing on the Sea of Tranquility...

the outcry of the photograph below, when it appeared in Life Magazine was enormous. This was decades ago; at a place called Minamata Bay. A google search will do nicely; I ramble enough here, and the photograph speaks louder and clearer then anything I could ever say; but simply, a mother, who ate the fish, and the mercury, in the bay, holds and bathes her child...

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TooCute
09-03-2003, 06:29 AM
. Im sure if I boiled down my filtered water in a teflon pan though, Id still find impurities. Im just trying to minimize my exposure.

I guess you don't realize that by boiling your water you're actually increasing your exposure. All you're doing is concentrating them by boiling off 'clean' water and leaving behind 'contaminated' water.

And you're probably shortening the life of your water filter, to boot.

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sr71blackbird
09-03-2003, 04:09 PM
I guess you don't realize that by boiling your water you're actually increasing your exposure.


Its good to read the entire statement I made. Anyway, to elaborate further, since there is an obvious failure in communication, what I do it, I test the tap water by boiling a CUP, straight from the tap, to determine its hardness content and particulate suspension. I take a cup of water and boil that down to nothingness in a teflon pan and check the calcium and elemental concentrations. I do that only to see how concentrated it is. Then, I take a large clean pot and fill it with tap water. That water I heat until boiling, but no more than a boil (Im not boiling this water down, which is where I assume it was thought that I was using boiled-down water-in that case it would be correct to assume I would destroy the effectiveness of the Brita's filter) This boiling kills any bacteria and renders the water sterile. I allow this water to cool for a day (covered) so I dont ruin the filter of the Brita. I then pour this sterile water through the Brita to remove as much calcium and hardness as possible. The clean, filtered water I then transfer to the fridge for drinking. I apoligise for not being clearer earlier.


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SatCam
09-03-2003, 05:04 PM
Thank god I was drinking and cooking with Evian already.

Evian is a French water. What were you thinking?

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Wormwood
09-03-2003, 05:22 PM
I'm living in Ronkonkoma now and I don't trust it.

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TooCute
09-04-2003, 09:27 AM
1. By bringing it to a boil, you're still concentrating it.

2. What's the purpose of "testing" the mineral content of your water if you're going to Brita it anyway?

3. Brita filters do not filter out microorganisms.

4. If you're actually worried about microorganisms, then simply bringing your water to a boil is not helping. You need to boil it at a full boil for at least five minutes to kill things like cryptosporidia and giardia.

5. If you actually boil your water for five minutes, you're wasting your time. Buy some aqua mira or other brand of chlorine dioxide. Add a few Dr0ps and you're done. You're still welcome to filter it afterwards if you like.

6. If you're boiling a cup of water plus enough water to fill up you pitcher and leaving water sitting out before you put it in your pitcher, you have too much time on your hands.

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TheMojoPin
09-04-2003, 09:43 AM
Sounds like some of you can't wait for the day that we can live in vacuum-sealed plastic suits.

Personally, I don't WANT my water 100% bacteria/organism/blue meanie-free. How the hell is my body supposed to build up a tolerance or defense towards ANYTHING if I go out of my way to introduce NOTHING for it to fight? I'm not talking like I'm drinking sewage or anything, but come ON. Suck it up...literally.

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sr71blackbird
09-04-2003, 03:57 PM
By bringing it to a boil, you're still concentrating it.


Thats only true if your thinking about the vapor that escapes from the boiling water. Aside from that, its a minimum quantity. If I boiled it down a significant amount Id see your point.



If you're boiling a cup of water plus enough water to fill up you pitcher and leaving water sitting out before you put it in your pitcher, you have too much time on your hands.


I have too much time on my hands??

Once my water reaches its boil, I cut the heat source. I dont let it boil 5 minutes, but Im sure the time it takes the water to begin cooling down is killing something in it. I really dont need a lecture, Im basically describing what I do. If you disagree and do things different, who am I to say? You present yourself as an authority and clearly you are well educated, but Id never contradict your posts because I have respect for your knowledge. Let it go.


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TooCute
09-04-2003, 05:42 PM
And because you're wrong!

HA HA!

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sr71blackbird
09-04-2003, 05:45 PM
I was told you have this "superiority issue" thing, so I will just let it go on your behalf.


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This message was edited by sr71blackbird on 9-4-03 @ 9:48 PM

monsterone
09-04-2003, 06:01 PM
i import my water straight from mexico. montezuma's revenge is for fags.

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SatCam
09-05-2003, 03:52 PM
I have too much time on my hands??

Hey, sometimes my Brita filter ends up in the fridge EMPTY because I'm too lazy to fill the motherfucker. You might as well order those 5 gallon jugs of Poland Spring that they deliver to your door.

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