Punk Rock and Ethnicity

[FMJeff]

I know this is a touchy subject considering my previous vacation worthy post, but this is actually not a mean-spirited question.

For all the black/latino/asian members, are any of you into punk rock? If so, what has that experience been like for you?

I'm writing a movie about a black teenager into punk rock and I need to do some research.

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Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes. </center>

[McNabbShouldDie]

Oh what? So only white guys are supposed to like punk rock? What a sick stereotype I fall under.


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[FMJeff]

Oh what? So only white guys are supposed to like punk rock? What a sick stereotype I fall under.


Not at all, music is for everybody.

Don't make this a race issue. It's not the purpose of the question.

I'm just wondering what's it like in a black neighborhood and someone's listening to like the Misfits or the Dead Kennedy's or Minor Threat versus a popular rapper...how is it recieved in that environment?

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[Tall_James]

Jeff, wasn't the bass player in "The Plasmatics" (old school punks) black? I seem to remember that he had a white mohawk.

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[FMJeff]

Jeff, wasn't the bass player in "The Plasmatics" (old school punks) black? I seem to remember that he had a white mohawk.


I don't know, I'm sorry. I'll look on the net though.

Look, the reality of music is people associate music with color...rap is black, punk is white...im not saying its right, im just saying that is the perception. Would Jimi Hendrix be as famous if he were white? or Living Color? Or Eminem if he was black? Eminem himself admits he probably wouldn't be as big as he is now if he was black.

It raises a lot of questions. Why are most hardcore bands white? Bla bla bla...

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[McNabbShouldDie]

I probably shouldve put "j/k" in my post...

I didnt read the whole thing, but maybe this will help you out Jeff. http://www.roctober.com/roctober/blackpunk1.html


I HaVe No IdEaS fOr A sIg PiC

<marquee bgcolor=00FF00> I feel so lonely in your world - So disappointed in your world - I'm making my own way - Trying to learn from my mistakes - 'Cause I've got no role model - No footsteps I can follow - I'm making my own way "Role Model"-H2O </marquee>

This message was edited by McNabbShouldDie on 11-12-02 @ 4:29 PM

[canofsoup15]

Is this gonna be 8 mile cept eminem is black and everyone else it white and hes rockin on a guitar.lol,jk.

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[Contra]

well i'm PR and italian and i love mostly all music. i mean hip hop is my main love, but i appreciate rock, puck, techno, jungle, etc. i love it all, as long as its not country or opera.

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[Earth2RON]

I love music just as long as it has meaning or makes me wanna get up and dance.I listen to rock, techno, jungle,rap, r& b....music is musid just as long as it comes from teh heart!

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[FMJeff]

Is this gonna be 8 mile cept eminem is black and everyone else it white and hes rockin on a guitar.lol,jk.


Nothing like it, the character is a fan, not a performer. he has no desire to be a punk rock musician...

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[TheMojoPin]

The DC hardcore/punk scene was really mixed between blacks and whites ten years ago...even more so back in the 80's...but not so much now. Everyone seems to keep to themselves or "their own", and it's boring.

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[alexc]

here is my stupid answer....
have you asked black earl?

[DC Reed]

Jeff i have a friend whos black and heavily into the DC Punk scene and he takes no heat in being a part of it. Infact many punk bands preach peace love and unity, so why would there be racism? Thought id throw my 2cents in.

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[FMJeff]

here is my stupid answer....
have you asked black earl?


hmm...good idea...ill email him...

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Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes. </center>

[DC Reed]

i doubt black kids would fight each other over whos better Nas or the Descendants...............

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[Recyclerz]

Not being a black teenager myself, I'll throw in my $0.02 by saying you should probably do a Google search for Bad Brains fan web sites. They were pretty big in the '80's punk world (I saw them once playing with X and they were really good). <P>
Of course, that was a long time ago and the ascension of hip-hop has really changed the (music) world a lot. <P>
Or you can ask Earl. <P>
::edit - Damn,I have to learn to type faster.::

You're only young once, but you can be immature forever. :-)

This message was edited by Recyclerz on 11-12-02 @ 5:13 PM

[Bob Impact]

I'll probably get into trouble for this but look into Candira, a NYC hardcore band for information about hardcore/punk black members. Punk was bigger in the black communities in the 80's but is having somewhat of a resurgence now. I know i've seen a lot more black punks in the shows lately, I can't speak for them but I can say that the ones I do see are all out, hawks, spikes, the whole nine.


-Bob Impact
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[MoeSyzslak]

For what it's worth, Lester Bangs wrote a piece in the 70's about how disgusted he was by the racism in the New York punk scene.
Also, Richard Hell's band, the Voldoids, had a black bassist.

[FMJeff]

Lester Bangs wrote a piece in the 70's about how disgusted he was by the racism in the New York punk scene.


know where i can find this?

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Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes. </center>

[MoeSyzslak]

Jeff, Sorry, you can find the essay in the book Psychotic Reactions and Carburetor Dung ( Like I wrote, by Lester Bangs). I think you can get it pretty cheap, but I could summarize it or possibly transcribe it to you if I have time, I don't know if it would be helpful.
The chapter is called the White Noise Supremacists, it's on page 272.



This message was edited by MoeSyzslak on 11-12-02 @ 8:44 PM

[Alice S. Fuzzybutt]

Jeff,

I know there were a whole lot of black and hispanic kids into the hardcore scene in the late 80s. Ironically, the whole hardcore/skinhead scene in the late 70s and early 80s became a racist thing. Trust me, a White Supremist who showed up at a CBGB's Sunday Hardcore Matinee was fucking TOAST!

Just my two cents as an editor... THAT would be an awesome idea to follow: a black/hispanic kid into the hardcore scene, considering the overt racial issues. Kids wore different colored laces in their Docs-- yellow for the asian kids; pink for the Gay kids, blah blah blah. There was always some dumb idiot kid from the 'burbs that would show up with white laces, having NO idea what it "meant." Yeah, NOT a good idea.

PS: Good luck with the screenplay!

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This message was edited by Alice S. Fuzzybutt on 11-12-02 @ 8:56 PM

[Drudge Jr.]

east bay ray - the guitarist for the best hardcore punk band of all time the dead kennedys - is black. that's the only one i can think of

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[Ryan the Great]

east bay ray - the guitarist for the best hardcore punk band of all time the dead kennedys - is black. that's the only one i can think of

how about the Bad Brains.

ive got quite a few black and asian friends who are heavily into the punk scene, it doesnt seem to matter very much nowadays what ethicity someone is if they listen to punk

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[Dirt Merchant 03]

you know what i don't even want to reply... nevermmind.

"Damn I'm Smooth."

[FMJeff]

well thanks for the input dirt merchant...


Jeff,

I know there were a whole lot of black and hispanic kids into the hardcore scene in the late 80s. Ironically, the whole hardcore/skinhead scene in the late 70s and early 80s became a racist thing. Trust me, a White Supremist who showed up at a CBGB's Sunday Hardcore Matinee was fucking TOAST!

Just my two cents as an editor... THAT would be an awesome idea to follow: a black/hispanic kid into the hardcore scene, considering the overt racial issues. Kids wore different colored laces in their Docs-- yellow for the asian kids: pink for the Gay kids, blah blah blah. There was always some dumb idiot kid from the 'burbs that would show up with white laces, having NO idea what it "meant." Yeah, NOT a good idea.

PS: Good luck with the screenplay!


I would love to collaborate...I'm doing research like any good screenplay writer...

Thanks all, I'll go buy the Lester Bangs book and read that essay.

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Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes. </center>

[TeRRoR]

ok, let me throw my 2 cents in now. first off. fuzzybutt, do not go saying the whole "all the skinheads became racist" because we didnt. i know in today's *scene* a majority of the skinheads in nyc are latino. and there are a handful of black skinheads. yes, granted there are your nazi skinheads, but do not label us all as nazi's

2nd, the hardcore scene in NYC for some reason i've noticed has been becoming more and more popular with latino's and blacks. i've been going to cbgb's since 1990 and it is what i did see. A lot of the dms kids are latino.

in the punk scene, i see a lot of latino punks and a TON of black punks today. it's crazy. for a while there werent that many, but now... there are just a ton of them.

If you need any info, get intouch with me. i'll give you as much info as you need. i've been doin this stuff for f'n 13 years now. i've been there, i've done it, i've seen it. I know im not as "oldschool" as others, but compaired to the kids today, im ancient

TeRRoR

Tell me all your problems and the way you're gunna solve them and i'll do my best, to prove you wrong

[TeRRoR]

and actually... lace color's meant other things

yellow = cop killer
green = irish pride
red = blood and honor
white = it did mean white power, but many people did wear them... white laces in combat boots do look nice.

in my boots there are red laces though. i like the way it looks.

when i was on tour in europe though... lace color means a lot over there... i just found it pathetic... down to a f'n uniform. THEY ARE JUST LACES!

TeRRoR

Tell me all your problems and the way you're gunna solve them and i'll do my best, to prove you wrong

[LilLibra]

Jeff, I'm not going to get on your case about this question. Its a legitimate one.

Now, I'm not into punk rock myself but my cousin is. She's more into the hardcore metal stuff but punk too. She's been in a band and everything. Her experiences aren't what you'd think they are. As far as I know, she never got that "you're a black girl in a rock band" look from people. Actually its more positive feedback since her band could hold their own on and offstage.

For others it might not be the same. For black guys especially since the whole thing is that if you're black, you're supposed to be into rap. They might get more strange looks then we did in those clubs but music is a double edged sword no matter what your color. The same way people will look at a white guy rapping strangely, some will do the same to a black punk rocker.

Did I even answer the question? I hope so :D


"I'm in a class all by myself... and its f*ckin' lonely."

[silera]

I'll listen to anything, but I won't know what it is or who sings it if it's "white people" music.

Ask me about Shakira though, I'll school you.



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[johnbravo]

I have been involved withe nj
y hardcore punk and now i am more into the ska scene for 12 years i have seen many F'ed things but one thing you could always count one was if there was a nazi at a show that person was going home with a limp i can recall this one time at the superbowl of hardcore in newark nj i think it was one of the last shows at studio one(that place was greatstiil the pipeline in newark was the best place in NJ all through the 90's to bad that ended)there were at least 700 people and maybe 5 nazis this one guy got beat by at least 12 the people and left for dead in the middle of newark it was brutal but it realy says a lot when you can get a hole group of people of all diff woks of life and get together because of music or an idea or lryic i have made friends for life now i am a dad married and more into ska than anything and that scene is full of all kinds of people more soo than any scene i have been involved in


why just have a cup of dirt
how about a dirtshake or a dirt pizza topped with extra dirt or you can come over and we can hop in the sack and take a dirtnap

[johnbravo]

teeror are you the same guy that was in hudnickstew sorry about spelling i suck


why just have a cup of dirt
how about a dirtshake or a dirt pizza topped with extra dirt or you can come over and we can hop in the sack and take a dirtnap

[Sheeplovr]

I'm writing a movie about a black teenager into punk rock and I need to do some research


there this kid name Dwian that is black and all into the nj scene ask him everyone knows him hes the black kid

number 333 its the way to be
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POWER AND CHAOS

[grlNIN]

No Doubt had a black trumpet player(i think he was the trumpet player) anywho theres another check off the list(jeff just dont use the black sharpee ok?)wait, that guy killed himself though, he still counts he was inthe band, eh i got nothin'...


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[Death Metal Moe]

I don't really give 2 shits about Punk rock, but if Death Metal got rid of all the "Ethnicitys", we'd be pretty lonely.

There's MANY Latinos, Mexicans, Afro-Americans, Asians, Arabs, and others.

WE're all different, but we all come together to KICK ASS.

I mean, sure, European Metal is lilly white, but I'm not too into a lot of it, ECPECIALLY pussy ass Black Metal.

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DEATH FACTION 4EVER!!!!

[TeRRoR]

no, i am not junior from heidnick stew...

im curious to know who you are because i've hung out at the pipeline for a long ass time. i really f'n miss that place. and the superbowl of hardcore's at studio one...

wow, those are bringing back the days. jesus f'n christ.

if you were part of the "thursday night pipeline crew", then most likely we would know each other.

damn, i completely forgot until now that Anthony Trance is dead. jesus f'n christ... im getting old... what happened to my youth?

TeRRoR

Tell me all your problems and the way you're gunna solve them and i'll do my best, to prove you wrong

[johnbravo]

dam it has been awhile we have lost a few of are friends remember uncle mark dam he was a great guy died to young well lets see thur was the night lot of fun right one of the best was hatebred when they were young 25 ta life E-town One4One Fatnuts alot of fun times AF dam i miss those times i am an old man now two i was part of the CEC there was like 5 of us that went to pipeline almost every week stone pony cbgb's lets see i had my septum peirced shaved head i always hade a red head kid with a lot of tats and a real tall m f'er um we were the steady ones sometimes a real fat kid and a few others ....you have a tat of spiderman cause i know you i am sure of it


why just have a cup of dirt
how about a dirtshake or a dirt pizza topped with extra dirt or you can come over and we can hop in the sack and take a dirtnap

[TheMojoPin]

There was a LOT of casual racism in the 80's NYC punk scene. When the DC hardcore kids would come up for shows, they'd get into some massive brawls over this.

Look at it this way, Jeff. Once hip-hop began to take off 20 years ago, it became the rock and/or punk for a lot of black kids. That was their revolution music, just like rock was for us. Now rap is the revolution music for most white kids. Will there be another black shift?

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[Drudge Jr.]

the dead kennedys were often misinterpreted as a nazi band. on phil donogheauesus's old show he was trying to compare punk rock to skinheads, and he said the dead kennedy's had a song called "nazi punks"

people also took the names "kill the poor" and "california uber alles" literally

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[Jobberific]

I am of mixed heritage; my father is black and hispanic and my mother is irish and italian. I'm into and punk and go to lots of shows. I've never had a problem at a show. At the last Dropkick Murphys show I went too my buddy (a black guy) and I spent the night drinking and shooting the shit with a group of skins. I'm not saying that racisim doesn't exist in the punk scene, I'm sure it does just like it exists everywhere, but its not nearly as prevelent as people think. At least not around here


"DANCE MONKEYS!!!! DANCE FOR OUR PLEASURE!!!"

[gone]

No Doubt had a black trumpet player(i think he was the trumpet player)


not sure the thats the punk we are looking for sweetness.. maybe it is, what do i know..

anyway. a very very very good friend of mine is african american punk. he like the older brother guy to all of use since he has his own house.. (well it was a house.. now its.. yickkk) he would give you the shirt off his back if you needed it. he has a dog named riot who is an alcholic and a drug addict. he does DIY tatts in his living room (ask to see mine some time)he always knows where the best parties and the best drugs are.

the funniest part is, across the street there are a bunch of stereo typical african american homies. they all come over and party at Ron's. there is no prejudice there. all are welcome.

jeff if you want i can give Ron your email or something. hed be a great person for you to talk to.

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[TeRRoR]

DIY Tattoo's are so dumb. so horrible. i've got 2 diy tattoo's and i regret them. they are so horrible. all my work is now professionally done. first off, the ink was horrible that was used for the diy. and you do not have all the proper tools most of the time.

onto the pipeline guy, johnnybravo. im trying to remember who you were. My name is Terror. I was there every thursday no matter what show it was. I am from new brunswick and was part of the inspecter 7 crew. I dont remember anyone with a spiderman tattoo. ya know who i miss though... i really miss manny big time. you gotta remember manny.

but ya, i see a bunch of those guys around, i just saw seth from fatnuts like last week. im good friends with dan murray from one4one. and the whole njbl and tek guys.

i'll pm ya later johnbravo

TeRRoR

Tell me all your problems and the way you're gunna solve them and i'll do my best, to prove you wrong

[johnbravo]

dan wow i have not seen him in years i heard he got married seth another good guy
njbloodline great guys too you said you were in with the insector7 crew you know drew or drewskin from middlesex wow makes me feel feal old now that i have a daughter and all my little brother is all into ska now and hangs alot with the pietasters every couple weeks in hoboken you must descride your self i cant recall the name but i suck with names i amm gonna start a new thread "the old nj
y hardcorepunk crews" and see who is out there


why just have a cup of dirt
how about a dirtshake or a dirt pizza topped with extra dirt or you can come over and we can hop in the sack and take a dirtnap

[TeRRoR]

ya, i know drew. im good friends with him. ya, it was sad to hear that uncle mark had died. i was good friends with him.

and ya, dan is now married with a kid. they were living in north brunswick, but moved to roselle park.

umm.... actually, here... i'll give you a link to a picture of me today, if that helps at all. whats your name? ya man, trust me i feel old too.

i find it really funny how there are kids out there that say "back in the day" and they are refering to like 1999. i look at them and laugh. im like "did you ever hear of city gardens?"

but ya, im terror. im a skin, i now have a lot of tat's, im 6'6 300lbs. i used to get into fights a lot. here is a picture of me.

http://iam.bmezine.com/7/h/l1g9pe/n1k20zmf.jpg

TeRRoR

Tell me all your problems and the way you're gunna solve them and i'll do my best, to prove you wrong

[johnbravo]

holy shit city gardens in tenton now that is going wayyyy back i actually saw minorthreat there wow hey if you talk to drew tell him jim and kristy said hello does he still have that roomate pete what a nut that guy was i know who you are now too


why just have a cup of dirt
how about a dirtshake or a dirt pizza topped with extra dirt or you can come over and we can hop in the sack and take a dirtnap

[TeRRoR]

hahaha, you remember who i am... that could also be a bad thing. im trying to think if i remember a jim or a kristy, the only jim's i know i know you arent them.

do you have a picture of yourself somewhere?

and hey, do you have aim?

TeRRoR

Tell me all your problems and the way you're gunna solve them and i'll do my best, to prove you wrong

[gone]

DIY Tattoo's are so dumb. so horrible. i've got 2 diy tattoo's and i regret them. they are so horrible. all my work is now professionally done. first off, the ink was horrible that was used for the diy. and you do not have all the proper tools most of the time.


ive had 3 DIY's. 2 have been since covered up. but i love this skull so much. i like it the way it is. i could never cover it

C*U*N*T
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[pauly boy]

a.s fuzzybutt is right about w.p. skins takin a beating. i saw jimmy from murphy's law and some of the l.e.s. crew pound on some douchebag with white laces in his boots at c.b's. terror and j bravo you guys are right on. i've been out of the scene for a while i'm sure i'm older than you i was around since about '83-'95

"don't make me come over there for you tough guy"

[johnbravo]

murphys law one of the best jimmy has got to be the nicest guy around nice to hear from a real oldschooler you put your years in you are like a capo in the scene


why just have a cup of dirt
how about a dirtshake or a dirt pizza topped with extra dirt or you can come over and we can hop in the sack and take a dirtnap

[TeRRoR]

the funny thing is Murphy's Law is still around.

It sucks, but im getting old. I do not have my youth anymore. I just miss being a reckless youth.

TeRRoR

Tell me all your problems and the way you're gunna solve them and i'll do my best, to prove you wrong

[johnbravo]

i will throw a band out there as the most brutal herdcore band ever BULLDOZE any one agree also Badluck 13 were pretty bad ass


why just have a cup of dirt
how about a dirtshake or a dirt pizza topped with extra dirt or you can come over and we can hop in the sack and take a dirtnap

[TeRRoR]

bulldoze just had played some reunion shows. they played up at cb's just a few weeks back

and im sorry, nothing beats badluck 13 on violence. there shows are off the wall.

but the kings of hardcore: SHEER TERROR

TeRRoR

Tell me all your problems and the way you're gunna solve them and i'll do my best, to prove you wrong

[johnbravo]

i missed a bulldoze reunion that sucks badluck 13 nothing like a bat with barbwire to the head sheer terror wow i forgot about them first time i saw them city gardens who is the best ska band live


why just have a cup of dirt
how about a dirtshake or a dirt pizza topped with extra dirt or you can come over and we can hop in the sack and take a dirtnap

[TeRRoR]

i can tell you what i do miss. i miss being at the pipeline on a thursday night, only being like 14-15 years old... and getting served... then getting home at around 5am, waking up at 6:30 to go to school... man... those were the days

TeRRoR

Tell me all your problems and the way you're gunna solve them and i'll do my best, to prove you wrong

[TheMojoPin]

No offense, but hasn't this degenerated into the kind of thing that e-mails or IM are best for?

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"You can tell some lies about the good times you've had/But I've kissed your mother twice and now I'm working on your dad..."

[FMJeff]

yeah, please stick to the topic and reminisce in your own thread...

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<br>
Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes. </center>

[pauly boy]

thanks bravo that's a real compliment. i just saw murphy's law last year. they opened for v.o.d. and clutch that was an early nite for me and my now ex-girl.some chick called jimmy an asshole and he told her "why do ya think they call me gestapo" sheer terror were badass. i'm a big fan of agnostic front roger is an intense vocalist

"don't make me come over there for you tough guy"

[LatinSpiceXoX]

What exactly is PUNK-ROCK?.. Is that like Green Day?
Cuz I love the stuff they play on Kroc, 95.5, z100(although that seems to be more hip-hop now)..
I guess what I'm saying is that I'm not your typical Latina who is stereotyped for listening to Salsa, Merengue, Rap and Hip-Hop only.

I enjoy everything from Techno, Freestyle, Rock, Pop, Alternative, Metal, Easy Listening, Rap, R&B, Hip-Hop, Spanish, House, and even a little Country.... but that just means that I'm eclectic and open-minded.

'..Keep your EYES on my BaBoomp BaBoomp Boomp!..'
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[LatinSpiceXoX]

I am of mixed heritage: my father is black and hispanic and my mother is irish and italian.
Does this mean that you're a macho/egotistcal guy with a big schlong who gets drunk and slices throats?

'..Keep your EYES on my BaBoomp BaBoomp Boomp!..'
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This message was edited by LatinSpiceXoX on 11-16-02 @ 2:42 AM

[fluffernutter]

Jeff, I am really psyched to see what becomes of the screenplay when you are done. When it comes to music as much as it does in life in general I see no color. It is really hard at times but my better side takes over.
Is there going to be a race issue in the film? Kind of like looking at how society may view ethnicity in punk compared to what punk is in your eyes and heart no matter what your ethnicity is. I know so many other bands have members of different ethnic backgrounds and that is what makes punk and so many other genres so special. It brings in a different "flavor" (see Sacred Reich - 31 Flavors) and can get you into stuff you may not be into. I would not have heard the Bad Brains if it were not for Rollins. I would have not listened to Public Enemy if not for Anthrax and so on. A great positive message can be brought out by all colors and creeds. Music doesn't need ignorance. Music needs unity.


WE're all different, but we all come together to KICK ASS.

AMEN!

I mean, sure, European Metal is lilly white, but I'm not too into a lot of it, ECPECIALLY pussy ass Black Metal.

Moe, I thought you would have had at least some Mayhem or Dark Throne albums.

<img src=http://members.aol.com/vikorynotvengnce/images/vinylcollsig.gif>

[Donnielimes]

BACK IN LIKE '81.... I remember meeting a girl who was a roadie for the CLASH I was like 16 yrs old and I went out with her after a party at my high school . I was really stoned and we were smoking weed and riding the bus . We ended up at the Chelsea Hotel in this rastafarians room he must have been like the road manager for the Clash. Well like all the guys in the band are running in and out of the room and we're like smoking these English Joints of hash which had big chunks of hash and tabbacco and that was one of the better instances of me getting high and being a young black/latino kid who likes punk rock. SOCIAL DISTORTION RULZ

[nickeye]

I'm writing a movie about a black teenager into punk rockPlease, please, please make him a basketball player, and call it "Dunk Rock". You'd be my hero.

<center><img src="http://mywebsite.register.com/db5/00487/njpconsulting.com/_uimages/nickeye.gif" height=100></center><center><i>when someone makes you a sig, you're his bitch forever</i></center>

[Heavy]

Why not make him a porn star and call it "Cock Rock"

<img src="http://sweet201.net/waddsig01.gif">
Join the ONA Army. http://www.onaarmy.cjb.net Please, help us save Black Earl.
Yes, he is hung like a horse. One female porn star describes having sex with Johneewadd as like giving birth.

[Donnielimes]

If you make him a pornstar won't it be called "PUNKJUNK"?

[FMJeff]

the last three posts of this thread have been teetering on the edge of extended vacation oblivion...

can we please stick to the topic and stop defiling?

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<br>
Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes.That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes. </center>